Planting canola with a John Deere Vacuum planter - Page 2 - The Combine Forum
Register Home Forum Active Topics Gallery Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-14-2013, 05:40 PM   #11 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
dudyou2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 472
Default

lol I am not lying . We ran knock out wheels . I haven't mislead anyone.
If you upgraded a existing product say so. Sounds to me you might have changed the materials from the sugar beet knockout wheels but you quoted that your parts are John Deere factory parts. Are you working for John Deere? And to tell me that 11 mph doesn't work, when you can't do it is silly talk. I did it and yielded the same as the rest of the crop.
I am giving guys the truth, cause we pulled out our hair trying to make it work. And it does work like I said. Just high wear and tear on the John Deere knock out wheels.
And tips broke off pluging holes. We made holes bigger in the meters to make the knock out wheels work but then had to reduce vacuum. Or canola would blow out the fan.
So if you changed the materials and kept the hole sizes small. Tell us.
If not it has been tried back in 2011 and worked but not the right way a planter should work.
The benifit of using air is the holes can remian small and canola will not blow out through the fan. Then if needed vacuum can be increased if fields are rough or speeds are needed.
How many acres are done using your system?
I just want farmers to know the whole story from guys who have done it.
Thank Darren

Last edited by dudyou2; 12-14-2013 at 05:48 PM.
dudyou2 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-14-2013, 06:09 PM   #12 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Red River Valley, MB
Posts: 254
Default

I never once said I was using factory John Deere parts. I said our parts were LIKE factory John Deere parts. As in they work the same way with no modifications to the meters needed. No air hoses, no control boxes, no compressors or ducting.

You however said that you used the knockout wheels that I am talking about. Which is 100% false.

I never said 11 MPH didn't work. I said it didn't work properly. Again, anyone with substantial planter experience knows this. Especially if you're concerned about wearing parts out, 11 MPH on gauge wheels, disks, closing wheels, packer wheels, meter drives, drill shafts and jackshafts causes more wear than 5 or 6 MPH. Especially at high seeding rates when you really get those meters turning fast. You can't tell me that doesn't cause more wear where the disk meets the meter housing and where the seals are rubbing on the disk itself. More speed is more friction which causes more heat which causes more wear. An air knockout doesn't eliminate any of these.

A few thousand acres have been done with our prototypes along with countless hours on a test stand.

Our holes are smaller, I felt this was insinuated when I said we had a canola-specific disk that we used down to 3.7 grams per 1000 kernel weight and had no issues, but I'll try to be more clear from here on out.

So in my eyes I still find that you stating that up to 11 mph is "no problem" and your air cleaning system is "100% trouble free" is misleading.

Nothing is ever trouble free and the speed thing is subjective. You can float canola on with a fertilizer spreader at 80 feet at 16 MPH and still get a crop, so why would you bother with a planter unless you wanted to use that planter properly?

This last season was my 9th year planting canola and I've been operating planters in corn and soybeans since the mid 90's. My experience bleeds down from my family who has been using planters in corn and beans since the 70's.

My main goal with this is to get farmers input costs down with higher yields, I don't really care if it's done with your system or our system but if we get guys out there trying to do it at 11 mph because of a poor recommendation and it fails due to the excessive speed, it might discourage others from using a planter in which case everybody loses.

Nobody plants corn, beans, beets, soybeans, cotton, anything at 11 mph, ever. Why? Because it doesn't work properly.

Last edited by jcalder; 12-14-2013 at 06:24 PM.
jcalder is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 06:44 PM   #13 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
dudyou2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 472
Default

John Deere is OK with this?
If a valmar would give me seed savings, yield and consistent yields every year. Every Farm in their right mind would use it. The seed to soil contact is still their at higher speeds and canola is not like corn that seed spacing affects yield, if they do come 1 inch closer to each other. We found seed spacing suffers but not yield. Due to seed row bounce. We have not heard anyone complain yet. I get your issue with high speed planting, but the cost savings on one machine out weigh the seed spacing some times. A lot of farmers looking a the planters have 2000 or more acres of canola to plant plus custom work to pay off the planter. We had one machine and went to two after two years too to reduce speed.Yield had no affect. We want to reduce the seeds per acre, as trials north of us report great results at 60000 seeds per acre.(Thanks to Justin for the brave guts to do it when all said it couldn't be done.) At these reduced rates speed would become more of a factor as a miss would leave quite a gap. Slower has always been better. 3 mph any planter will shine. I never stated that faster was better.
The Air Box has had no issues yet.....cross my fingers.
The meters work no problem at 11 mph. 140 hole.
Seed spacing suffers, like I stated is from row unit bounce.
But still amassing compared to any Air Tank blowing seed down shanks.
The last field I planted was in the rain and if it wasn't done that day it would have been done by a valmar, or never seeded at all. It was mudded in but was still one of the customers best fields. (At faster speeds around 9 mph)The last pass was so wet I could barley drive off the field. Speed sure paid that day. Hour longer that day and the field would not have been done. Not what I like to do but it sure was a race against mother nature that day.
dudyou2 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 07:02 PM   #14 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Red River Valley, MB
Posts: 254
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dudyou2 View Post
John Deere is OK with this?
John Deere is ok with what? Developing a disk and knockout wheel for use in their planters? Yes, the guys who paid me a visit from the factory last spring were perfectly fine with it. I thank Greenvalley Equipment for bringing them out.

Last edited by jcalder; 12-14-2013 at 07:07 PM.
jcalder is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 07:05 PM   #15 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
dudyou2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 472
Default

Ok
dudyou2 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 07:19 PM   #16 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Red River Valley, MB
Posts: 254
Default

We've been working on this for a very long time, it started out as asking Deere themselves to do it. They said the sugar beet disk was good enough. We disagreed. 9 seasons later we have a solution that works without any modifications of a stock John Deere planter.

With your air cleaning system, what disk are your customers using with John Deere planters? The small sugar beet disk? If so your meters are still spinning really fast since that disk only has 45 cells. Our disk with your air knockout would work well for those who don't want to have a mechanical knockout and who want a disk specially designed for canola seed.
jcalder is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 08:21 PM   #17 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
dudyou2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 472
Default

I don't sell disks for John Deeres but there is a guy around here that has made a few sets for guys. I think they are somewhere by 90 hole or as many they could get in one row.
And the two are using e set meters I think.
Not sure. Precision Planting. Costly though.
That's why a few guys got them made.
Just as long as there is one row of holes I guess.
A farmer around here talked about some disks he might get to try out
From a guy from MB.

Case IH started making Case IH meter disks for canola.
The better quality of meter disks the better!!
The first ones we used were not field ready by no means. lol.
If you have field ready disks that fit Deeres, it would save headaches for sure.
dudyou2 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 09:06 PM   #18 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 235
Default

would a ccs system work with canola?
w-mFarms is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 11:48 PM   #19 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
dudyou2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 472
Default

yup, a farmer around here is planting with central delivery on a John Deere and two Case Ih planters are that I know of.
dudyou2 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-14-2013, 11:48 PM   #20 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 24
Default

Jcalder what's the hole size? How many holes? Life expectancy of disks and knockouts? What model of Jd's were used planting? Do you have any pictures of the disks and/or knockout wheel? What varieties of canola have been planted with your set up? What kind of vacuum was used? Was it no till or tilled planting?
ctcairns is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the The Combine Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:08 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0