Out With The Air Drill and In With.....?

[Andrew_D]

We are running a JD 1820 (51') with 1900 cart for the last couple of years. Now, we have not been impressed with the JD....poor emergence, poor metering - not happy. Figuring it was the crappy conditions in 2010, we checked the drill over and used it for 2011. Again, crappy conditions, but also crappy emergence and metering. We were looking at the drill last week with one of the dealer techs and found some shanks that need major work. Part of this is wear and tear...stuff that moves will wear out. The real bummer is that we found a few shanks that weren't even in front of the packers! Turns out it was a 7.5" machine originally and when it was traded in, the dealer couldn't move it, so they turned it into a 10" machine. Unfortunately, we missed out on the fact that some of the shanks are out by 1/4" - 3"! The dealer is moving shanks around currently and we are probably going to be stuck with this machine for 2012...2 bad years does not make the banker want to loan a pile of money!!!

So what to plan for in the future? We knife our NH3 in the fall, so the ground is blackened up a bit for spring warmup. Spring moisture is generally not a problem around here. We have some hills, nothing super steep, but this is pot-hole country so ditches, water runs, etc. are the way of life here. Also, rocks seem to grow no matter what.

I'd like to go with an independent opener machine (disc? shank?) with the ability to either side band the PKS blend, or preferably a twin-row setup. Most of what I've seen on the independent openers says they are great in zero-till, but depth consistency gets questionable on tilled ground. I'm thinking that going to as wide a packer wheel as possible would help this?

Morris C2 looks interesting...nice wide packer wheel. The local JD dealer is hooking a 1910 cart behind one as we speak...I'm planning to go for a look this week.

JD is kind of lacking on wider machines. I looked online at 1890, 1895, 1990, etc. but most of them max out around 40-45 feet.

Bourgault 3710 can be had in 50' or 60' with 7.5" or 10" spacing...

Others????

Andrew

P.S. Before the independent opener thing got started in my head, I was planning to go to a 5710 or even nicer a 5810!!! But I don't think the little hills and valleys are helping my seeding depth and emergence any! Independent is the way to go I think...

[Andrew_D]

I've been doing more research...

John Deere:
So the only JD independent opener I see that can handle 2 products is the Conserva-Pak opener and it doesn't have a very wide packing wheel (3.5" v-shape). Anyone know how it would do in tilled ground?

The 90 series opener is single shoot. Most of JD's machines use single shoot openers and then mid-row the fertilizer. Since our NH3 is already down, I'd rather use a side-band or twin-row setup.

I just checked JD's website and I see that the 1890 is now available in 50 and 60 feet, but it still uses the 90 series opener...single shoot.

Not crazy about Deere's 1900/1910 cart due to our experience with it.



Bourgault:
5710/5810: Not independent openers.

3310/3320: Can anyone comment on experiences with the different packing wheels on tilled ground? (4.8" pneumatic, 4.5" and 5.4" semi-pneumatic)

3710: The anti-hairpin seed boot would give a side band setup. Same packer choices as the 3310.

5000/6000 series carts: I've been impressed by what I see on the cart. We rented one this fall for winter wheat and liked the cart (5350 w/ variable rate).



Morris:

C1 Contour Drill: The standard Morris opener is available in either a side band or twin row setup. Packers are similar to the BG 3320: 4.8" pneumatic, 4.8" and 5.5" semi-pneumatic.

C2 Contour: I like the looks of the packer (http://www.morristrashtalk.com/asset...gallery/13.png). Is this the same 5.5" pneumatic that the C1 has? Not much info on the website yet...Is it basically an updated version of the contour drill?

I like the idea of the flat distributors on the Morris. It should be more gentle on the seed when it isn't making a 90º turn in a tower distributor.



Flexi-Coil:
I only see air drills with rear packers on the web site.



Case:
Case Precision Hoe 800: Double shoot sideband is available.



New Holland:
Only see air drills on their web side....



Seedhawk:
Openers are available in either a side-band or twin-row setup.
Couldn't find any info on the packer wheel.



Seedmaster:
Couldn't find any info on the packer wheel.
Side-band knife.



Andrew

P.S. Really I need 3 things: Drill Frame, Openers, Cart. Whether they are from the same company or different ones is irrelevant I think...time to mix and match!

[jwsrules]

New holland has a indepenent drill i believe the 2070 same drill as the case, made by flexicoil.

[Andrew_D]

Originally Posted by jwsrules

New holland has a indepenent drill i believe the 2070 same drill as the case, made by flexicoil.

hmmm...I thought I looked at NH's page and the 2070 was an air drill style...like the BG5710, etc. I'll have to look again.

I thought I'd see more similarity between the drills on FC/CASE/NH websites.

Andrew

[Andrew_D]

I guess I should have looked a little closer!

P2050 is a "traditional" air drill. Available with 3", 4", 5 1/2" semi-pneumatic packers.
P2060 is an air drill that folds like a set of harrows. Still uses shanks and rear mounted packers though. Available with 3", 4", 5 1/2" semi-pneumatic packers.
P2070 is an independent drill. Same as the 800 from Case. 4.8" rubber packers. Side band opener.

Andrew

[jt]

I say go with the Morris C2 over the C1. Trash flow is far superior.
Morris also have a new 4.5" semi-pneumatic packer which from what I'm told performs better than the 5.5" in muddy conditions. The Morris carts are reliable and accurate so you can't go to wrong with them but depends what features your chasing, they all have some good idea's.

[Andrew_D]

Originally Posted by jt

I say go with the Morris C2 over the C1. Trash flow is far superior.
Morris also have a new 4.5" semi-pneumatic packer which from what I'm told performs better than the 5.5" in muddy conditions.

I'm hoping to look at a C2 this week. Any idea how the packers perform in tilled soil?

Originally Posted by jt

The Morris carts are reliable and accurate so you can't go to wrong with them but depends what features your chasing, they all have some good idea's.

Yeah, most of our other stuff has green paint, but when I look at JD's seeding line up, I'm not impressed. Seeding is the one chance to get the plants the best chance possible. Weeds can be fixed. Disease can be fixed. Fertility can be fixed.

I'm even considering a frame from Company A, openers from Company B, cart from Company C...whatever is going to work!
I think that the best cart would be a set up like Valmar where they meter into the 1" lines right at the tank. No distributors at all!

Andrew

[Blue Oval Man]

Originally Posted by Andrew_D

Seeding is the one chance to get the plants the best chance possible. Weeds can be fixed. Disease can be fixed. Fertility can be fixed.


[I think that the best cart would be a set up like Valmar where they meter into the 1" lines right at the tank. No distributors at all!

Andrew

Totally agree seeding is most important operation of the season.

Choices then will be seedmaster or the older Conservapak 4400, which could be built into a good cart with some upgraded meetering.
David.

[Andrew_D]

Originally Posted by Blue Oval Man

Totally agree seeding is most important operation of the season.

Choices then will be seedmaster or the older Conservapak 4400, which could be built into a good cart with some upgraded meetering.
David.

Have any info on the seedtwins packers?

Andrew

[dieseldog]

JD no till lineup is probably the best there is. Hard to beat the 1890's and 1895's.