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I'm Desperate

14K views 43 replies 16 participants last post by  wavesofgrain 
#1 ·
So last year it was the engine in our 2009 485 Quadtrac (5800hrs). Bad valve seats in the head at the factory wore out the valve guides and let exhaust into the crank case.

This year its an electronic gremlin....we think. Last week the tractor stopped in hear a couple of times as if I had stepped on the clutch pedal. After a sec, it started going again and all seemed fine. After doing this about three times it finally threw a Trans Code 54 and stopped. Tech came out and said one or both switches on the clutch pedal were bad. We thus replaced them.......no difference. The tractor ran about 3 minutes and then threw Trans codes 54, 11, 111. After hours of checking wiring and such they put in an ASSIST and came back and said to change the transmission controller. So we did.......nothing. The tractor moved ten feet then threw a Trans Code 37 and stopped. Now the dang thing is stopped in my field and throws a 37 every time you put the FNR lever in gear. Case is stumped, multiple dealers have looked at it and are stumped. And, of course being stumped means they are getting hard to get ahold of by phone and are suddenly busy on other jobs. Meanwhile I've got 300 ac left to seed, a nervous landlord, a tractor stuck in the middle of the field, and I'm having difficulty tracking down a rental. Our drill takes a lot of HP and hydraulic flow for our area so tractors with the right stats are hard to come by for rent.

So does anyone have any ideas?? This red piece of junk would have been long gone if our area hadn't seen 3 consecutive drought disaster years and its now starting to look like maybe #4 is coming. So I'm stuck trying to fix it I guess. The best idea I've had involves a can of gas and a match.
 
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#4 ·
I've wondered that too. I forgot to add that as best as I can see the alternator is putting out an easy 14V (and is nearly new) and I removed and cleaned as many ground points on the machine as I could find (the ones in the battery area and the big one up on the engine to the frame). If there is another ground point that may be the issue please let me know.
 
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#5 · (Edited)
Code 37 is BOC open or Neutral Relay open. I was told there was no adjustment in the BOC switch. Tech installed it. so how do you adjust it?

Also I swapped out the relays. I can manipulate the BOC switch with my thumb and make the neutral relay click away no problem. Dealer says there is no way its the wiring harness as it "tested" good (whatever that means). If its continuity that isn't always an indicator of a bad wire. If they'd give me the wiring schematic I'd have jumped the wires by now.
 
#9 ·
I love my old Versatiles. I'd rather spend the money on increasing my oil flow on a say an 1153 which has big power for the most part already. This newer junk they build is expensive out of the gate and a pain in the ass to trouble shoot. K.I.S.S (keep it simple stupid) should apply to anything agriculture. Give me a clutch with a pedal and a mechanical lever anyday. Hydraulics the same! This crap is nice at the time of purchase but will haunt you once the hour meter moves a bit. I worked in the bush for 10 years operating equipment and saw many a new skidder and processors with all the computer junk just parked with a brandt truck beside it. The old skidders were the ones bringing home the bacon day after day. You get these new computer mechanics out and if the computer can't tell them whats wrong they are screwed and can't think outside the box. One guy we had out with a newer skidder changed an injection pump and throttle fly by wire system and computer because the machine would work for 10 min and then run out of power. His laptop lead him in all directions. $25,000 dollars later and no results an old local guy came out. He asked has anyone installed a pressure gauge and plumbed it in just before the pump? $5 worth of hose and a gauge he kept in the cab off he went working the machine until it started its acting up as usual. He saw the fuel pressure drop almost to zero with no response from the pedal and just idle. He took both filters off and removed sections of fuel line to find a piece of crap intermittently closing off the fuel supply. Brandt spents days!! This guy spent 3 hrs!!!!
 
#12 ·
Those problems get frustrating. Hope you get it figured out soon. I also hate when a piece is fine mechanically and the electrical sometimes makes you pull your hair out. All I can suggest is St. John Hardware or did you try Walla Walla and Colfax JTI? I know they all have lots of quad tracks out in the fields. Good luck.
 
#15 ·
Ok so Dad and I went over and got the clutch error (Trans code 37) out of the way. Apparently in the panic the tech hadn't checked that when he replaced things and the BOC switch was activating at 30%. So that got rid of that........BUT....

I ran a little while like I did before and BAM the thing kicks out and we get Trans code 54 (which is the only consistent code we've gotten) and also once or twice get codes 60 and 111. But usually always code 54 is in the mix. The tech is completely confused (I'm kinda wondering about that.....but then he is the only guy I could get to come out, we're pretty remote). I've called JTI, St. Johns, Odessa, etc. No one has had this particular problem. Some have suggested a bad transmission solenoid. So how do i know this is the problem?? Would it throw another code? Some say maybe, some say maybe not. Once upon a time I thought that with all this frustrating tech came the ability to at least diagnose it. Apparently I'm mistaken. Everything else we run is Deere, I'm not really color loyal but I can say that I have NEVER had this level of trouble figuring out a problem in the rest of our stuff.
 
#18 ·
The 111 has only come up a handful of times but the 54 has been a consistent problem. It drives me crazy how it can run perfect for about 5 min than just pop up the code and you're done. I'll look into jumping the wires.
 
#19 ·
I had a stx375 a long time ago that would just go into nuetral. As soon as it would work owner kicked me out of the cab. I ended up replacing shuttle and problem never came back. Hve your mechanic check the shuttle lever and all of its internal switches. There should be a specific ohm reading through switches when closed. There is a troubleshooting tree with that fault. He will have to read it and perform tests.
 
#21 ·
They are replacing the FNRP lever tomorrow. Act of desperation I guess. Everything is checking out ok. It will run only about 4-5 min before it kicks out. I hate this tractor.
 
#22 ·
Our 535 was throwing itself in and out of gear the second year we used it, nasty. The dealer removed the shuttle from another tractor in his yard and put it in ours and it worked for a couple of days and it started again. The service manager ended up coming out and after an hour of stuffing around with laptops and calibrations he decided to start pulling things apart to check wiring. Within minutes he found one of the clutch wires had been wrapped around something and rubbed though. Everything else they had done was just moving the wire and they thought they had fixed it
 
#23 ·
We had t9030 that did the same thing. It was a cracked solenoid near or on the transmission controller.
It had a hairline crack in it and it let moisture in. Part wasn't available for the tractor.. You had to buy the whole controller. New holland haybine has the same solenoid on it and it's available.
 
#24 ·
Sorry to hear about all the problems waves, we had a 480 that had a wiring gremlin somewhere that caused the auto-steer to do crazy things at times. They replaced everything except for the main wiring harness for the tractor, but we traded before that got done. It is somewhere down by Dayton I believe now. Probably no help but the 2012 500 we have now has been a great tractor with minimal problems. It seems that maybe they have improved the quality control on the newer ones which OTC has said are much more reliable. Is it dry down there it is so wet up here we have places I hope we can harvest and or get on before this fall, I think I might be the only guy not to get stuck this spring. Anyway hope you figure it out, I have been there with a tractor when its time to go and it won't work, terrible feeling!
 
#26 · (Edited)
Glad to hear the newer ones are better. Maybe one day we will find out (although Grandpa is John Deere to the core. It darn near killed him when we got this thing and I think he sort of enjoys watching us curse it.) It's dry here in the horse heavens. The wheat looks really good right now but there isn't enough moisture to carry the crop til harvest or maybe even another month. Some spots are already showing stress. All the rain the rest of the state got passed us by the last few months. Last real rain was in Feb. Just had two large farms hang it in this year. Too many crop failures year after year and another one on the way by the looks of it. They've had enough, can't say I haven't considered it myself. I've heard of a few suicides actually, unending drought is hard on the psyche is guess.
 
#25 ·
#27 ·
Thanks a ton! The diagnostic codes section appears to match our tractor exactly. Our tech has already "gotten ahead of himself" on a couple of occasions and I wouldn't mind reading along myself as he goes through it.
 
#28 ·
There is lots a guy can do himself with the right info even without specialized equipment and so finding this kind of info more my MXM tractor (same as New Holland TM) and STX tractor has been golden. As with any link you dont know how long it will be good for so when you get time it may be a good idea to have all the files right on your computer.
 
#29 ·
We havent caught hardly any of the rains lately either, but we had a ton of snow over the winter. I believe a couple of guys in town measured over 80 inches of snowfall and I know we had 4 feet on the ground, have a picture from feb 1 of some HZ drills out in a field that were almost buried. Those same guys claim we have gotten over 14 inches of moisture since October which would be above normal for an entire year. Downside is it was so dry last fall that getting a stand up was almost impossible and there is a lot of spring wheat being planted and a lot of very poor winter wheat around. Supposed to rain maybe Wednesday night into Thursday, that would be nice and I hope you guys get some as well.
 
#31 ·
Maybe I should go for the big bud next. We need 600+ hp and greater than 55gpm flow with 5-6 hyd scv's.

Sorry can't disagree that you need 600HP if you pull that big of equipment and the old tractors don't make that much. For a smaller guy like me 400HP is big enough and it keeps my operating costs way down. Stops me from buying a $500 000 airdrills to make payments on in bad times and the $400 000 dollar tractor to pull it with. Your drill is worth more than all my machinery combined. If I started buying into the farm more, make more payments, I would have a nervous breakdown. We as farmers have been coaxed into this and brainwashed that you need to get bigger to be more efficient. Efficiency is a term which I relate to debt. Banks hate guys like me. My pencil scratchs in the bad years which have been more often than not lately and my pencil tells me K.I.S.S. I am my own mechanic which helps as well. Never had a service truck in my yard ever yet, other than to update my guidance system. He was in the area and offered so why not. My theory is 200 hrs a year on a machine doesnt warrant a huge expenditure. I hope you don't think I am criticizing you. Just expressing my point of view and I have been known to be wrong in my decisions before. Everyone has a different scenario.
 
#37 ·
No offense taken. Your kind of farming is what a lot of us should aspire to. Actually my drill isn't really large by Canadian standards as its only 37ft. However the 40% hills we drag it up necessitate a high hp tractor with a ton of grip. Anything else is just dangerous. A D6 still works just fine too, not so much of you're notill though. In the PNW the hillsides are often where the only dirt is.
 
#33 ·
Okay I think you jinxed me! In 2500 hours this tractor has never has a transmission fault code, but this morning, what do you know TRANSMISSION FAULT ! I don't know it's number because I have nothing to read it with. Thankfully it still functioned normal though.

Displayed temperature was good as well as the pressure and the fluid level is correct or even higher. Clearing the warning display three different times with the reset button did not help.

I then stopped and moved the selector on the column though all of its positions including reverse about 30 times as well as cycling the orange neutral button on the end. In about 5 minutes it faulted again. My only hope then was that the fault was in the temporary memory and was on a timed reminder.

I shut the entire unit down and turned off both of the battery disconnect switches. I cycled each of those disconnects each about 30 times for good measure to ensure solid conductivity in those contacts.

Alas the ! icon is now gone from the uppermost display below the fuel gauge and everything is as good as new! Go figure.
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#36 · (Edited)
Well we got it going today. It was....CASE's FAULT!! Actually we probably had a bad trans controller. However the tech shorted two wires when he reinstalled things. He taped them together and they intermittently would short and cause the problem. Thanks to the info Kenmb gave me Dad and I went out and tore the cab apart after a confused tech left when the new FNR lever didn't do a thing. Found the wires late this afternoon, taped them up proper and ran 6hrs no problem. Let's hope this is it.

Since I've just been through this I'll pass on what I learned. Press and hold the DIAG button, it will bring up all the controllers and you can select TRANS and look at the codes (use the arrows and PROG as the "select" button). If you go to the links Kenmb provided on page 3 of this thread and look at the T9000 manual Section 55 Chapter 4 you will see all of the trans codes and the associated diagnostic tree for the code. It was a lifesaver for us. A very guilty looking shop manager told us he is willing to "negotiate" on the repair bill. He better be. Good luck with yours. Hope this thing isn't contagious!
 
#35 ·
We had the same thing happen on our 535. The tractor would just kick into neutral and about throw you through the window. After thousands of dollars and the run around between Case and Cummins, it ended up being the computer for the engine. It was tell the transmission that it was lugging and throwing it into neutral to try to keep it from "stalling". Hope this helps you.
 
#39 ·
Thanks. I chased the theory of a speed sensor problem all day since occasionally the speed reading on the corner post was inaccurate or would go to zeros. The speed sensor is on the left side close to the yoke of the forward driveshaft.

However this tractor also has radar and we think in that case the radar speed is on the corner post and not associated with the transmission code. It's much dustier than normal here and the radar is rearward facing under the nose of the tractor. When going down roads or in a crosswind I think there is just too big of a dust storm under the tractor, but that's not affecting the transmission.

We got some help involved on the phone and by using the same code search as described in the thread we determined that the transmission pressures are minutely too low. Don't quote me on the specs but I think it needs a minimum of 250 PSI just over 1400 RPM, we're at 243. At full throttle it needs to be a minimum of 280 PSI, we're at 276. I'm told that a particle smaller than you can see with the naked eye can cause this in the pressure control solonoid which they are coming out to service and pressure test this morning.

There has been no slippage but the # 777 in my calculator tells me it's prudent to wait for this to be serviced.
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