The Big Massey - Page 29 - The Combine Forum
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post #281 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-22-2018, 09:57 AM
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Any word if the combine will be at Ag Days in Manitoba?
Were the Gleaner and Massey combine even there last year? I don't remember seeing them. However if they are serious about the Fendt combine in MB it probably should be there, I'm just not sure how serious the dealer is about it because pushing the Ideal will probably interfere with a well established Claas market. I think they are letting someone else be the guinea pig on this one, which is probably the right move at this point.

In this situation it would have made way more sense to allow Massey dealers to sticker the machine as well and sell it as Massey.


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post #282 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-22-2018, 05:41 PM
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I would love to see it as a Massey. My personal opinion is that it looks better as a Massey as well.

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post #283 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-22-2018, 05:55 PM
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Were the Gleaner and Massey combine even there last year? I don't remember seeing them. However if they are serious about the Fendt combine in MB it probably should be there, I'm just not sure how serious the dealer is about it because pushing the Ideal will probably interfere with a well established Claas market. I think they are letting someone else be the guinea pig on this one, which is probably the right move at this point.

In this situation it would have made way more sense to allow Massey dealers to sticker the machine as well and sell it as Massey.
Not sure in Manitoba but only select Fendt dealers can sell the Ideal this year, Agriterra and Trochu Motors.
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post #284 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-23-2018, 12:48 AM
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I have heard that the Ideal will be in Brandon, but I'm not sure where it will be displayed.

The only Fendt dealer in Manitoba has traditionally had a separate display from the rest of the AGCO dealers. They show Fendt row crop tractors alongside Challenger tracked tractors and Claas Lexion combines, whereas the rest of the AGCO dealers display Gleaner and Massey combines, and Massey tractors and equipment.

The Fendt dealer has shown no interest in demonstrating the Ideal, focusing instead on selling Lexions, and that they will not take any AGCO combines on trade, even ones that they have sold.

I know of at least two Massey dealers in Manitoba who are prepared to take on the IDEAL franchise, and who have customers interested in making purchases.
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post #285 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-23-2018, 01:18 AM
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I have heard that the Ideal will be in Brandon, but I'm not sure where it will be displayed.

The only Fendt dealer in Manitoba has traditionally had a separate display from the rest of the AGCO dealers. They show Fendt row crop tractors alongside Challenger tracked tractors and Claas Lexion combines, whereas the rest of the AGCO dealers display Gleaner and Massey combines, and Massey tractors and equipment.

The Fendt dealer has shown no interest in demonstrating the Ideal, focusing instead on selling Lexions, and that they will not take any AGCO combines on trade, even ones that they have sold.

I know of at least two Massey dealers in Manitoba who are prepared to take on the IDEAL franchise, and who have customers interested in making purchases.
And this is exactly why they should sticker that thing however necessary and allow Massey dealers to sell them if they are prepared to do so.

But you can't fault Agwest for being cautious and sticking to the Claas combines, after all it is the best machine on the market right now and they have exclusive rights to sell them in MB. They have a lot invested in the Claas combine market and do a good job servicing that market with lots more potential. As of right now the Ideal is still just a unit that looks good on paper, nothing has been proven beyond that.

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post #286 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-23-2018, 11:22 AM
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AGCO will sooner or later likely produce a large four tracked farm tractor. A strategy to release that as a Massey only would grant the Caterpillar affiliated dealer groups their peculiar wish to be left alone, and likely trigger a new building expansion boom.

There has to be a logical reason why the talk of a Challenger branded IDEAL has stopped as well. I think you’re talking about it.

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post #287 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-23-2018, 12:15 PM
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I certainly don't fault any dealer for sticking with a business plan which they believe is working, and I don't think that any manufacturer should force any of their dealers to push one brand over another from a different manufacturer. It is entirely the dealer's right to continue to leverage the investments they have committed to whatever brand is contributing to any success they may be enjoying.

However it is clear that there are currently no dealers in Manitoba who can or will support IDEAL, either because they have the Fendt franchise but are choosing to focus on Claas Lexion, or because they do not have the Fendt franchise and AGCO is not interested in granting new franchises.

This was my concern from the beginning with the decision to market IDEAL as Fendt only in North America, whereas it also, or even primarily, marketed as a Massey in all other markets. Some regions will be under-serviced, or even not serviced at all.

Currently all of the IDEALS are being built in Italy, but representatives from AGCO have indicated that eventually they want to be producing IDEALs in Kansas. If the plan really is for the IDEAL to be primary combine brand for AGCO, eventually the current North American Massey design, and possibly even the Gleaner, will be phased out. Obviously, this compounds the problem, as current Massey and Gleaner customers would be left orphaned unless the IDEAL is offered by their local dealer.
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post #288 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-23-2018, 12:28 PM
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One good thing about where I live, 10 km from Trochu Motors, there is bound to be some close by next season!
Itís my closest dealer.
Well, I guess Deere is about 100 meters closer, ha ha!
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post #289 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-24-2018, 04:09 PM
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And this is exactly why they should sticker that thing however necessary and allow Massey dealers to sell them if they are prepared to do so.

But you can't fault Agwest for being cautious and sticking to the Claas combines, after all it is the best machine on the market right now and they have exclusive rights to sell them in MB. They have a lot invested in the Claas combine market and do a good job servicing that market with lots more potential. As of right now the Ideal is still just a unit that looks good on paper, nothing has been proven beyond that.
I agree with everything you have mentioned SWMan. I would refute "The best machine on the market" claim however. We went from an MF 8460 (Claas) to an MF rotary, and I can honestly say that we have never looked back. I, am sure that the Lexion is a fine machine, but I have looked at it and it is too much like the old 8460. besides, we are only minutes from our local MF dealer and if we do have an issue, it is only a matter of lifting the header and driving right to the dealership where it is attended to immediately. Having said that, I don't think we have had more then 4 or 5 hours of down time in the last 8 years with our current 9560. Right now with what our MF dealer has for a product offering, the Massey Ferguson is the best machine for me. Just my experience.
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post #290 of 461 (permalink) Old 11-24-2018, 04:43 PM
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I agree with everything you have mentioned SWMan. I would refute "The best machine on the market" claim however. We went from an MF 8460 (Claas) to an MF rotary, and I can honestly say that we have never looked back. I, am sure that the Lexion is a fine machine, but I have looked at it and it is too much like the old 8460. besides, we are only minutes from our local MF dealer and if we do have an issue, it is only a matter of lifting the header and driving right to the dealership where it is attended to immediately. Having said that, I don't think we have had more then 4 or 5 hours of down time in the last 8 years with our current 9560. Right now with what our MF dealer has for a product offering, the Massey Ferguson is the best machine for me. Just my experience.
I am not saying a Lexion is for everyone, but if grain loss/ability to harvest in tough conditions/overall capacity/ability to adjust threshing from separation are your main reasons to choose a combine then(right now) Claas is clearly ahead of everything else. Claas is even far ahead of Claas when you compare a new machine to a 5 year old one.....and they have a new model coming out next year likely!

I won't fault 95%+ of farmers for not knowing this though, how could they?


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