Claas/Sunnybrook zero degree (ZAPS) research - The Combine Forum
 35Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-07-2017, 06:12 AM Thread Starter
HI!
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Three Hills/Trochu, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,232
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Quoted: 4622 Post(s)
Claas/Sunnybrook zero degree (ZAPS) research

A feeding issue in peas at high feed rates (50+T/HR) got me to thinking about this. The slower cylinder speed used in peas (300 to 400) aggravate this. A 780 is at least a 70 T/HR machine in peas.
Feeder would make an odd noise for a short period of time before plugging the feeder, the APS, or both.
SWAGged that material was feeding above APS shaft centreline packing material at top of feeder house. The 36 degree (-36) backswept angle, smooth, APS caps acting too much like a paddle and not enough of a material advancing device.

Sunnybrook working with me on this project.

The lessor steep, used paddle in the pic is -14 backswept, that eliminated the feeding issue I have observed in peas and header limitation became the new limit. ****, it’s always something, I want engine power limit! About 150 seperator hours on that paddle.
The more erect paddle is zero “0” degrees to shaft centerline. Ran about 1.5 hours in flax and about three hours in swathed canola. Season then ended preventing further testing.
The 0 paddles will only have less feeder rattling and maybe reduced dust, the higher rotating speed and material nature will not lend to any difference in feeding wheat or barley.
Paddles were changed from -14 to 0 mid afternoon, couldn’t tell any difference in the flax feeding wise between the -14 and 0 degree paddle but running feeder house depth was only 35 to 50.
Dust may have been reduced at the feeder house by 0 over the -14 but wouldn’t hang my hat on that.
Rattling of feeder house was less at high canola feed rates with the 0’s.

Pros:
- Eliminates feeding issue in peas
- Reduces noise emitting from feeder chain area at high feed rates

iffies:
- Reduced feeder house entry dust

Unknowns:
- Rock protection
- Possible APS drum wrapping with crop material
- Reduced seperation at APS concave (irrelevant in wheat and canola as well as 12 section rotor separation)
- Or...maybe the notched leading edge will thresh/and/or separate better

More testing required:
- Definitely

Comments?
Sunnybrook will have samples at Agritrade this week in Red Deer, the ones in the pics to be exact.

https://www.thecombineforum.com/forum...1&d=1510053726
https://www.thecombineforum.com/forum...1&d=1510053790

Attached Images
File Type: jpg E6CAA61D-A7DC-4020-A96E-61C0E8D4EE92.jpg (540.1 KB, 144 views)
File Type: jpg 6642D31D-F369-41D3-A060-60D64DC69C60.jpg (479.1 KB, 171 views)
File Type: jpg 9D0044D6-29E6-459C-8603-7F01467F7754.jpg (486.1 KB, 131 views)
SunnybrookW&M and chance2 like this.

Last edited by Don Boles; 11-08-2017 at 06:53 AM. Reason: Pic attachment difficulties
Don Boles is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-07-2017, 08:39 AM
Senior Member
 
seedcleaner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Mid-Missouri
Posts: 2,448
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 366 Post(s)
Good testing and I agree with your thoughts. I think as a more permanent and costly fix, something like these discharge beaters look like a good fix. I currently have many stations beat to heck from foreign material entering feeder.

If a drum could be designs as a large suction fan, it would be excellent.

New Holland Archives - Precision Farm Parts Inc.

seedcleaner is offline  
post #3 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-07-2017, 08:47 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,941
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Quoted: 1023 Post(s)
That discharge beater looks a lot like the sunnybrook impeller. It would be nice to get a high inertia drum in that area as well.
SouthernSK is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-07-2017, 10:00 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,941
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Quoted: 1023 Post(s)
The back swept design is a design that reduces the HP to drive the APS and also helps release the material going into the cylinder. It will be interesting to see how the straighter paddles work. The belt drive for the APS is barley adequate for the job. I was wondering in longer tough flax like last year if the straight paddles will wrap. Let us know how it works next year Don. I wondering if a smaller drum and deeper paddles like the Sunnybrook impeller would help as well.

Last edited by SouthernSK; 11-07-2017 at 10:13 PM.
SouthernSK is offline  
post #5 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-07-2017, 10:35 PM
Senior Member
 
SWFarmService's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Regent, SW North Dakota
Posts: 9,729
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Quoted: 2677 Post(s)
Don
First a little pointer with pics is there is the little "picture" button that is yellow with a mountain and the sun right next to the link button. Click that and paste your pic link into the little box then your pics will show up large. Don't be afraid to ask questions, I have thought about making a thread explaining it.

To the combine part, I am not familiar at all about how the rock trap on them things work but I doubt rock protection will change. Changing that angle should also help reduce feeder back feeding.
It would be neat to see a pic of them on the drum. Do they still maintain a bit of backswept angle to them? Personally I would want them at 90 degrees if that's not what you did.

If wrapping occurs it's something else causing it.

If that thing starts thrashing a bunch of grain it will fill your rock trap and make it useless so unless you find that full of grain don't sweat it.

Loosing the backward angle will reduce power consumption.

God Bless America
SWFarmService is offline  
post #6 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-08-2017, 09:00 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dubovyy, Russian Federation
Posts: 3,491
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 1163 Post(s)
The idea of the back swept design is to comb through the material while the feeder chain still has it. Straightening out the stems and evening out the wads.

Like SouthernSK said the double B belt is barely adequate as it is, make it too positive and your going to increase plugging at the APS.

Loosing the backward angle will increase power consumption. Which could increase productivity provided your not all the sudden snapping the belt or smoking it every time you hit a healthy wad.
SouthernSK likes this.
joesixpack is online now  
post #7 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-08-2017, 09:52 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,941
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Quoted: 1023 Post(s)
The backward angle definatley will use less power. It is very dramatic when designing fans. Just look at the hp reqired for a Bourgault fan with straight blades that is conveying air rather than straw versus the backward swept blade fans like on the flexicoil. In our area last year the straw loads were low compared to the previous years. I have snapped a few to many APS belts and would like to see how it works on a heavy tough straw load year. It does not take to much of a wad sometimes to snap the APS belt. Your productivity goes in the crapper the minute you have to start changing belts. I would sooner run a little less capacity and run trouble free all day long then plug or change belts. Maybe the antiplug feature will help with this compared to our older designs.
SouthernSK is offline  
post #8 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-15-2017, 02:13 AM
Senior Member
 
Darcy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: WC Sask
Posts: 478
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 54 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernSK View Post
That discharge beater looks a lot like the sunnybrook impeller. It would be nice to get a high inertia drum in that area as well.
A high inertia APS would be the cats meow.
Darcy is online now  
post #9 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-18-2017, 01:28 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Swan River Valley Manitoba
Posts: 713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 191 Post(s)
Just curious is there enough adjustment on the aps grates to allow for the longer to centerline distance as you steepen the angle or did you shorten the cap length ?
EBEAR is offline  
post #10 of 143 (permalink) Old 11-18-2017, 06:21 PM Thread Starter
HI!
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Three Hills/Trochu, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,232
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Quoted: 4622 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by EBEAR View Post
Just curious is there enough adjustment on the aps grates to allow for the longer to centerline distance as you steepen the angle or did you shorten the cap length ?
Overall diameter from shaft centreline to the high point on the caps is the same as normal caps.

Don Boles is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Combine Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in













Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sunnybrook guts into new lexion? Twix Claas / Lexion 127 02-09-2019 09:44 PM
Paid Ag Research Ted Ketelsen Announcements, Help, & Ideas 7 06-08-2017 12:08 AM
Cultivator Sweeps (Width, Degree and HP)? Ron.Koster Planting & Tillage 12 05-30-2013 07:55 AM
Paid market research about tucano combines absandgails General Farming Board 0 03-25-2010 06:49 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome