Survey marker in wrong place? - The Combine Forum
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post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 12:53 PM Thread Starter
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Survey marker in wrong place?

Latest acquisition has an orange Alberta survey marker post at the SE corner, I don't see a buried peg anywhere. Then about 20 feet further north(to my detriment), there is a brand new fence installed entirely by the owner of the quarter south of me. Lots of stakes along the fence, and a nail with ribbon right at the corner, but again, I don't see a survey peg. The survey plan for this property also seems to indicate the marker being south of the property line, and the fence looks to be on the property line. No comments on the survey.

Could it be that the orange survey stake is incorrect? What takes precedent if it is? The neighbor is the owner of a large local gravel company, had intentions of developing for gravel, but could not obtain permits. So not a fly by night operation, I don't know him well, but we have met. Fence was reinstalled along previous fence line. I should take gps over and see if fence is actually straight with the world, but are they necessarily straight, or were there errors in the original surveys, and they take precedent?

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post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 01:08 PM
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Lots of those orange markers "disappear" or get moved, but there is nothing grey about true survey data and that is what determines legal boundary. Had a mile of "new" boundary along edge of land here - to my detriment - where neighbor decided to construct a new fence that was at least 20' inside original; he paid for survey and constructed fence accordingly. Funny enough, just bought some trees out in BC and there was hodge-podge of survey ribbons, markers etc from appraisals/sales gone by, but the very old axe blazes that marked the survey reference trees at corners of property were right-on what computer showed when you were standing there. Usually the way people "protect/mark" boundaries gives a pretty good indication of who you are dealing with.

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post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by jvw View Post
Latest acquisition has an orange Alberta survey marker post at the SE corner, I don't see a buried peg anywhere. Then about 20 feet further north(to my detriment), there is a brand new fence installed entirely by the owner of the quarter south of me. Lots of stakes along the fence, and a nail with ribbon right at the corner, but again, I don't see a survey peg. The survey plan for this property also seems to indicate the marker being south of the property line, and the fence looks to be on the property line. No comments on the survey.

Could it be that the orange survey stake is incorrect? What takes precedent if it is? The neighbor is the owner of a large local gravel company, had intentions of developing for gravel, but could not obtain permits. So not a fly by night operation, I don't know him well, but we have met. Fence was reinstalled along previous fence line. I should take gps over and see if fence is actually straight with the world, but are they necessarily straight, or were there errors in the original surveys, and they take precedent?
Original surveys take precedence, we have some very crooked surveys in my area. There is no way I could go off gps, but it would be nice. If you can find the buried pins is better than going off the orange stake.
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post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 02:40 PM
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You definitely can't use a tractor's GPS heading line. That wouldn't take into account corrections the surveyors made as they moved across the township, or the natural grid distortion as you move farther from a meridian. The quarter line may not be exactly north and south as surveyed.

It's pretty amazing how the surveyors managed to layout squarish blocks of land over a round surface, and used things like chains and transits.
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post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 02:50 PM
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Get out the metal detector and look for the pin.
Quite often the pin is just buried in the dirt.
However here where the bush has grown up since settlement and bush was cleared with a cat the pins get rooted out when that happens.
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post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 03:48 PM
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survey markers

Anyone have a picture of these survey markers?
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post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 06:01 PM
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The survey markers in Alberta only mark the one direction. They are not used to mark the corners. So often you will see 2 survey markers 200 feet apart. One marks the North-South line and the other the East-West line.

The fence is probably in the correct location.
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post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 06:32 PM Thread Starter
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The survey markers in Alberta only mark the one direction. They are not used to mark the corners. So often you will see 2 survey markers 200 feet apart. One marks the North-South line and the other the East-West line.

The fence is probably in the correct location.
Thanks, that's the kind of info I was looking for. That also explains why I often see survey markers in the middle of a property line.
I had always assumed that the markers were the equivalent to a pin, But your explanation makes much more sense.
I'll check for the pin one day before worrying about it.
This isn't the kind of operation who would spend a bunch of money putting a fence in a random fence in the wrong location.

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post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 06:52 PM Thread Starter
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Just had a look on my way by. Saw another survey marker cross the road It was almost lined up with the new fence on my side of the road. And there is a pin right below it. Although the property line fence on that side of the road is at least 100 feet too far south. So I dug around on my side of the road and found the survey pin right underneath the orange survey marker with ribbon tied to it. I looked at the fence closer and it has a significant curve to it so apparently what I said in the last post wasn't very accurate.

So how can the property lines on both sides of the road be offset by almost 20 feet? Does the survey pin take priority when it can be found, or do the surveyors measure from another known point?

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Last edited by jvw; 06-19-2019 at 06:55 PM.
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post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by brazil08 View Post
Lots of those orange markers "disappear" or get moved, but there is nothing grey about true survey data and that is what determines legal boundary. Had a mile of "new" boundary along edge of land here - to my detriment - where neighbor decided to construct a new fence that was at least 20' inside original; he paid for survey and constructed fence accordingly. Funny enough, just bought some trees out in BC and there was hodge-podge of survey ribbons, markers etc from appraisals/sales gone by, but the very old axe blazes that marked the survey reference trees at corners of property were right-on what computer showed when you were standing there. Usually the way people "protect/mark" boundaries gives a pretty good indication of who you are dealing with.
Iíve known farmers who move the survey stake so it corresponds to where they wanted the fence to be! Real stupid idea

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