How to increase business costs & make a country uncompetative! - The Combine Forum
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 02:44 AM Thread Starter
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Unhappy How to increase business costs & make a country uncompetative!

Now without exception, rural OZZIES - especially those providing food & those providing services to primary producers, are just about numb f..ked with all this CoR bullshit.
But read this - oh please, Canadians, Americans & anyone in the world - read it & see if your bureaucrats have the ability to f..k up your country as well!

https://www.nhvr.gov.au/files/201510...or-farmers.pdf

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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 11:45 AM
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Ummm dude, that’s mostly just common sense. Heavy trucks on the road just can’t be operated by zombies ready to crash at any moment.

We don’t have to run log books on our short hauls. Farm exempt. But we sure don’t push it either.

Combine operators on the other hand! I think we need a night crew.

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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 12:22 PM
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Sounds similar to CDL requirements for truck drivers in the states. I don't have a CDL for these reasons. Glad I am exempt as a private operator. I think that is how the law looks at it here. Not really because I am a farmer, because I am private doing things for me personally, not charging others to haul their stuff. Non-commercial.

That would add another complication to the fun of harvest and farming. I am bad enough keeping good records let alone a trucking log book. It just wouldn't happen here. I never hit pavement during harvest. Hardly drive on a county road. Us farmers do all maintenance to the section line roads and some that are considered country roads.

I did notice the paper was from October 2015?
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 05:17 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by joesixpack View Post
Ummm dude, that’s mostly just common sense. Heavy trucks on the road just can’t be operated by zombies ready to crash at any moment.

We don’t have to run log books on our short hauls. Farm exempt. But we sure don’t push it either.

Combine operators on the other hand! I think we need a night crew.
The trucks on roads bit ....... yep, truckers have got to be responsible for the road worthiness of their own truck, the load requirements of their own truck & their own health etc. etc. etc.
However, the CoR (chain of responsibility) extends way past the truck driver in this legislation.
Me as a contract harvester are “responsible” ..... & guilty until proven innocent - if a “work place incident” occurs either on farm or down the road under this legislation, because I was a participant in the chain of loading of a truck or have a responsibility to check or note & advise if there is any breach of OH&S laws. This literally extends to someone else - owner or their worker - not having a guard on some part of their machinery or the employee doing something stupid. Common sense, including lack of common sense, has nothing to do with OH&S & CoR regulations & is no excuse if the employee doesn’t show any!
The degree of (my) responsibility is determined by a criminal court! The fu#ken last place you’d want to be!

Oh, & take note of the maximum hours of work. This means double the workforce required, double the costs ....... where are you going to get double the skilled people required when you can’t find enough now ........

Last edited by rod; 09-20-2019 at 05:19 PM.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 05:55 PM
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Over regulation is a straight jacket to good people...even with all the regs someone will still find a way to have some sort of accident. Truck driver regulation has failed to stop some of the worst accidents in my provincial history...I'm sure at some point even the new will regs will fail. I don't have all the answers, but no amount of regulation is going to fix individual responsibility. They should take all that effort and start some farm schools taught by people who have had accidents and experience, and im sure that wouldn't be perfect either, but it may yield some better results than giving somebody credentials to try to enforce some rules made by people who have probably never even set foot on a farm.
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 06:01 PM
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I believe large companies monopolize industry with regulation in the name of safety. Health care to railroads. Sure they spend a lot, they also charge a lot. Make sure it is almost impossible for ANYONE new to get into that industry. I truly hope this never comes to Ag in any place in the world.

My kids used to watch a cartoon movie. One of the characters would try to get their way by saying "it is for the children". Horton Hears a Who! Had to look it up.

I do not have an answer fro these things. Education and simply being responsible for your own actions is the best way. Takes a few idiots to wreck it all.
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 06:05 PM
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I thought about 12 months ago that the CoR was backed off to what you are directly involved in, not the stuff beyond your control
I'm not a mechanic and cannot make a assessment of the roadworthy of the third party carrier's truck loading my grain, their responsible for that.
When the carrier arrives then I'm responsible for a safe operating site and loading equipment....

Climate Change; if you don't produce more food or natural fibre than you eat or wear, then YOU are the problem!
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 06:09 PM
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I believe it is pretty much like that in Canada now. As an employer, you can't force a worker to work over a certain number of hours and can't deny them sufficient time off for sleep. If fatigue is found to be the cause of an accident, it's your fault.

It's easy enough to be pleasant, when life goes by like a song. But the man worth while, is the man with a smile, when everything goes dead wrong!
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rod View Post
The trucks on roads bit ....... yep, truckers have got to be responsible for the road worthiness of their own truck, the load requirements of their own truck & their own health etc. etc. etc.
However, the CoR (chain of responsibility) extends way past the truck driver in this legislation.
Me as a contract harvester are “responsible” ..... & guilty until proven innocent - if a “work place incident” occurs either on farm or down the road under this legislation, because I was a participant in the chain of loading of a truck or have a responsibility to check or note & advise if there is any breach of OH&S laws. This literally extends to someone else - owner or their worker - not having a guard on some part of their machinery or the employee doing something stupid. Common sense, including lack of common sense, has nothing to do with OH&S & CoR regulations & is no excuse if the employee doesn’t show any!
The degree of (my) responsibility is determined by a criminal court! The fu#ken last place you’d want to be!

Oh, & take note of the maximum hours of work. This means double the workforce required, double the costs ....... where are you going to get double the skilled people required when you can’t find enough now ........


So just to clarify your company A custom harvests.

You contract company B to haul the grain.

Company B’s truck driver has an accident and was proven to be over hours. Your liable because you loaded the truck?
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-20-2019, 07:50 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by joesixpack View Post
So just to clarify your company A custom harvests.

You contract company B to haul the grain.

Company B’s truck driver has an accident and was proven to be over hours. Your liable because you loaded the truck?
If I load a contract truck directly from my header (combine) & that truck has an accident, either on a public road or a farm road, & the driver of the truck is found to "over hours" or over loaded, or drug affected etc. etc. etc. ........ I am, & the farm owner, are absolutely in the "chain of responsibility" (CoR) & will find ourselves in court! And I don't own the farm ........ I'm just there harvesting the growers crops!

If I load into a grain cart or mother bin & that loads into a truck ........ & something happens along their trip ....... I'm still in hot water ..... some of the CoR is reduced ....... BUT not all!

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