Alberta/Saskatchewan are pissed! - Page 5 - The Combine Forum
View Poll Results: What do the prairies need?
Separation 72 57.14%
Stay part of Canada 17 13.49%
Equalization relief 37 29.37%
Voters: 126. You may not vote on this poll

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post #41 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by dookiller View Post
My 2 cents. The seats in office need not be decided by population. Why is a populated area that never gives to the economy get all the seats. Seems idiotic. It should go by your tax base and the money your province produces for the country. Then you won't be able to have all the say and shut down every project because you just have a population. You need to produce revenue. Seats then can be adjusted every election by how your province is giving to the economy.
i totally agree, there has to be a value component to your say, and, even maybe some regional size also. Some areas, are huge, with great economic potential for the country, and have no say since they are so few people there.
Have not provinces, should not be driving policies in the federal government, that benefit more transfer payments for their social programs, that even the have provinces cannot afford.

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post #42 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 12:37 PM
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My 2 cents. The seats in office need not be decided by population. Why is a populated area that never gives to the economy get all the seats. Seems idiotic. It should go by your tax base and the money your province produces for the country. Then you won't be able to have all the say and shut down every project because you just have a population. You need to produce revenue. Seats then can be adjusted every election by how your province is giving to the economy.
The reason for the electoral college in the US is so that the whole country can not be ruled by a couple, relatively small but highly populated districts. Without the electoral college, New York and California would dictate who forms the government like Ontario and Quebec does here.

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post #43 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 02:06 PM
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I think that a part of the solution to controlling regional inequities in this country lies in reforming the senate. A system similar to what I understand the US has which provides a fairer regional representation. Each province would be allowed a set and equal number of senators and thereby would have the power to vote on and through that vote, defeat any nonsense or discriminatory House bills and policies that are only in the interest of one area of the country. And if a senator decides to vote against his constituents he could be immediately recalled and replaced. It would provide a balance between population based and regional representation. That likely was the historical intent of having a senate. Unfortunately the Canadian senate has become little more than a rubber stamping body which has been issued only a "passed" stamp and is only a expensive retirement reward for party faithfuls.

This was the basic premise as best I can recall of the 3E (elected, equal and effective) senate that was proposed a couple of decades ago. But under the present system, since it doesn't serve Ontario and Quebec interests, good luck, now as then, of ever seeing any meaningful change.

All things considered though, at the rate things are going to **** in this country, I'm all for separation. The sooner the better. Short term pain for long term gain. Is it going to be easy? Probably not but nothing worthwhile ever is. I'm willing to take the risk. Genuinely tired of being bent over by the rest of the country.

Seeing a lot of similarities in this debate to the Wheat Board debate.
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post #44 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 02:45 PM
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We had a conservative govt and they didn't even try to touch the senate. It cant be the solution then. They instead tried to woo Quebec which lasted for exactly 4 yrs and then Libs back in.

There is another issue in this country that politics cant solve and that is there is animosity and outright disdain for people of different groups. English and French despise each other, east and west, BC vs AB, natives vs Canada, socialists vs libertarians, liberal elites vs conservatives, etc etc. There is so much division in the country its frightening. You can see it in the political discourse. Remember when fort mac burned? Did you see any water bombers from down east or volunteer fire fighters come here. We actually got messages from people saying it was our own fault and we deserved it.


There might not be a way around some of those issues even with a new political arrangement. We might be better off being separate and neighbors instead of family members. It might be more divorce than break up.
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post #45 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 03:02 PM
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Every province needs to be treated equally, regardless of population or how much money it has. This would at least give everyone somewhat of a voice. Senate should be scrapped all together. No donations should be allowed to a politician or political party, just buys too much corruption. Politicians only get paid for campaign promises that they follow through on. Any corruption or illegal activities when in power gets a jail sentence, no matter what, but any false accusations nets the same results. Just some ideas in my little old mind.

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post #46 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 03:17 PM
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I'm still waiting for some explanation to my question in post #30 of why those in the West are so hard done by? Simply saying that you are being treated unfairly won't cut it, how exactly is your standard of life below where others in the country are at?

It's quite interesting that nobody was asking for separation in 2015 when the Prime Minister came from Calgary. We haven't even completed a term of T2 yet and the guy is presiding over a dumpster fire of a government, don't you think there is a chance Canadians come to their senses and change course? Heck, Alberta put in a wing-nut NDP government with ZERO experience last time around, great track record the voters of Alberta have...

If we could build some accountability into the management of our various levels of government then I have hope that they could still serve our interests. And I do still have hope that people are becoming aware of the crooked nature of media and decide to think independently, that's a big one.

Comparisons to the US are useless, totally different system. I'm not sure why we should listen to some economist from the states telling why Alberta should break off and join the US either, whose interests do you think he is serving...

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post #47 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 03:44 PM
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I'm still waiting for some explanation to my question in post #30 of why those in the West are so hard done by? Simply saying that you are being treated unfairly won't cut it, how exactly is your standard of life below where others in the country are at?

It's quite interesting that nobody was asking for separation in 2015 when the Prime Minister came from Calgary. We haven't even completed a term of T2 yet and the guy is presiding over a dumpster fire of a government, don't you think there is a chance Canadians come to their senses and change course? Heck, Alberta put in a wing-nut NDP government with ZERO experience last time around, great track record the voters of Alberta have...

If we could build some accountability into the management of our various levels of government then I have hope that they could still serve our interests. And I do still have hope that people are becoming aware of the crooked nature of media and decide to think independently, that's a big one.

Comparisons to the US are useless, totally different system. I'm not sure why we should listen to some economist from the states telling why Alberta should break off and join the US either, whose interests do you think he is serving...
Terrific post!
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post #48 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 03:52 PM
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I'm still waiting for some explanation to my question in post #30 of why those in the West are so hard done by? Simply saying that you are being treated unfairly won't cut it, how exactly is your standard of life below where others in the country are at?

It's quite interesting that nobody was asking for separation in 2015 when the Prime Minister came from Calgary. We haven't even completed a term of T2 yet and the guy is presiding over a dumpster fire of a government, don't you think there is a chance Canadians come to their senses and change course? Heck, Alberta put in a wing-nut NDP government with ZERO experience last time around, great track record the voters of Alberta have...

If we could build some accountability into the management of our various levels of government then I have hope that they could still serve our interests. And I do still have hope that people are becoming aware of the crooked nature of media and decide to think independently, that's a big one.

Comparisons to the US are useless, totally different system. I'm not sure why we should listen to some economist from the states telling why Alberta should break off and join the US either, whose interests do you think he is serving...

This post is like driving 90mph into a brick wall and just before you hit looking over at buddy in the seat and raising your beer and saying this Canadian sure is smooth.

Let's start with this? It's honestly hard to fathom.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/near...rvey-1.4262094

"Saskatchewan and Manitoba residents were the most likely to be near insolvency, at 56 per cent, up eight percentage points from the previous poll, MNP said. Alberta residents were second at 48 per cent, up eight points. Ontario and Quebec followed at 46 per cent each, up six and five percentage points, respectively. Among residents surveyed in Atlantic Canada, 45 per cent said they were $200 or less away from the financial brink, but that marked a decrease of four percentage points from the September survey."

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post #49 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 04:02 PM
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Its election year for Alberta and Canada. I believe that there was alot of 30 year olds that wanted to see if a different government would do, so the ndp got in. Now it will go back to the way it was in the past, or that is my sort of thinking. Which doesnt mean much because its decided by the people in the city. And with the federal it seems like it always goes back and forth be conservatives and liberals. Get tired of one and the other comes in and then do it all over again.
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post #50 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-03-2019, 04:29 PM
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It is not only the financial inequities though between central Canada and us, their's is a completely different ideology. To them issues like the environment, special rights and funding for every self interest group known to man is core to who they are. Money is no object and its all guaranteed by the sacred Charter of Rights and FREEdoms. (which in my opinion should have gone in the hole with its main architect Trudeau I). For example I am sick and tired of watching 4 mostly empty school buses go by my farm daily because the Charter guaranteed the right to have different schools and even separate bussing for different cultures. All at tax payers expense.


As for who is paying more income tax, when you step back and consider the gov't is taking almost 1/2 your money off the top plus all the other taxes and fees on top of that, quite frankly I don't think I'm getting my moneys worth. A properly run government with sensible objectives could get better results with a fraction of the taxes needing to be collected. Unfortunately any major changes to this country will never happen because Quebec and the Media will never allow it.

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