JD 12.5lt mess - Page 2 - The Combine Forum
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post #11 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 07:45 PM
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You could really cheese off your Deer dealer and do something like swap in a C-13 cat. I'm sure you could get one for less than $75k. I suppose it would be a PITA to get all the electronics to work, it might get your dealer thinking outside the box if you start proposing 'radical' ideas. I'm not a Deer guy so I don't know what physical differences there are between the tractor and combine engines. I would imagine the ECM and the turbo? may be different, but I'm assuming that they don't have a different block. Some times these deer dealers a miserable to deal with, which is why I don't deal with them, unless its unavoidable.

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post #12 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 08:33 PM
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Might as well put a good engine in considering Deere's are junk. Get a cummins.

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post #13 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 08:51 PM
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I also had a water pump fail on a 9500. I was close to a water well and I ran a lot of water in the radiator before I knew what had made it get hot. I drained all of water and called my J.D. man. He told me to flush it with diesel fuel and run it with diesel and engine oil mix for a few about 15 seconds after I had installed a new water pump. I drained that mix and did that four times, changing the filter each time. I then I ran it with oil only for a short time, drained that over night. The next day I added new oil , filter and ran it about an hour in the field. I drained that out and more new oil and filter. The engine had 900 hrs. on it at the time. I am still running it a 2500 hrs. The J.D. house likes to sell me oil and filters!! I hope you can use this and save your engine.
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post #14 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 08:59 PM
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I thought there was also a factory remanufactured part # for that engine. It seems to me it came up on this site a few years ago?
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post #15 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 09:05 PM
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Ya I'm pretty sure there was a thread about this already. It's a common problem I've seen a few engine rebuilt because of this issue. I've replaced lots of pumps on tractors none on combines yet. New water pumps have a cage on them to keep the balls from the bearings falling into the timing gears.
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post #16 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 09:43 PM
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They must of started running the pumps off the timing gear in the mid 80's? When they came out with the 50 series tractors. "Thought I read this somewhere." What was the advantage as compared to just simply running it off the belts? Something to do with a variable speed fan maybe??
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post #17 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grainline View Post
New water pumps have a cage on them to keep the balls from the bearings falling into the timing gears.
Well, it's good to hear that a newer pump is available that, at least tries to, fix the problem.


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Engine doesn't overheat. Doesn't get a chance to.. Bearing fails on water pump, which is positioned above timing gears, bearing falls into timing gears etc, end result cracked head cracked block, destroyed every gear on front of motor. Great design.
Yup. Gear driven water pump. Stupid idea.

What exactly was wrong with a belt driven water pump anyway?

I'm surprised that nobody has come up with a way to place the water pump in the block, but instead of having a shaft come out the back of it with a seal that can fail, put the shaft out the front and come up with a way to belt drive it.

Andrew
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post #18 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 09:45 PM
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They must of started running the pumps off the timing gear in the mid 80's? When they came out with the 50 series tractors. "Thought I read this somewhere." What was the advantage as compared to just simply running it off the belts? Something to do with a variable speed fan maybe??
If it was run off of the crankshaft pulley, the pump speed would be directly tied to engine RPM. Same on the gear train.

Andrew

Edit: Regarding the 50's series question. I wasn't sure, so had a look at jdparts. 4250 shows both a belt driven and gear driven water pump. 4650/4850 shows gear driven. 8450 shows belt driven.

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post #19 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 09:46 PM
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Cat's have had gear driven water pumps for ages but obviously when they fail they don't **** the bed when they do it.
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post #20 of 114 (permalink) Old 02-22-2016, 10:56 PM
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So I'm confused. Never looked closely at a 50 series or newer design. But I'm assuming even with the gear driven pump there still must be a fan belt that would also turn the alternater of course. So does the fan run independently of the water pump off the belt, or is it driven off the water pump gear driven shaft? Just gonna take a wild guess but I had some literature around here at one time on the 50s, and I know they had increased fuel efficiency over the 40s. I remember somthing about a variable speed fan. So mabye running the fan independent of the pump was part of achieving the better efficiency. Any input anyone?

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