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Discussion Starter #1
Has anyone noticed the new JD multicoupler electrical connector... looks like an ISObus connector. no more 31 pin. I guess MacDon or Honey Bee headers are not an option anymore...
 

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ISOBUS (technically j1939 actually) is a great fit for this sort of thing. MacDon and Honeybee need their own ECU on the header is all. In some ways this simplifies things rather than having an increasing number of wires for different header functions that weren't around years ago. If everyone adopted a standard set of PGNs (j1939 messages) that would be a boon to header inter-compatibility. But this is John Deere here... they no doubt require NDAs and hefty license fees from the 3rd party manufacturers.
 

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I used a S780 for a few days. It was setup for the new hdr header. One snap ring and that plug pulls out the back and the other wire plug was T’d in, behind, slide it threw and away you go to older header.

Doubt the X9 is like that, they will want you to buy there header.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
ISOBUS (technically j1939 actually) is a great fit for this sort of thing. MacDon and Honeybee need their own ECU on the header is all. In some ways this simplifies things rather than having an increasing number of wires for different header functions that weren't around years ago. If everyone adopted a standard set of PGNs (j1939 messages) that would be a boon to header inter-compatibility. But this is John Deere here... they no doubt require NDAs and hefty license fees from the 3rd party manufacturers.
Talked to the headsight guys to see what they know... its not isobus. its proprietary and JD looks like they are not sharing... hmmm.. [edit: it is the isobus connector, but not open for use like isobus. different somehow at the signal level].
 

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I'd be really surprised if it wasn't j1939 on canbus. Everything else in a John Deere is. I'm not surprised they aren't sharing the PGNs they use, at least without some pretty nice pay to play fees and NDAs and such, which they will have to do as there are crops that require headers they simply don't make. What a bold milestone it is when John Deere has now added what's effectively DRM for their headers and attachments, if true.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I'd be really surprised if it wasn't j1939 on canbus. Everything else in a John Deere is. I'm not surprised they aren't sharing the PGNs they use, at least without some pretty nice pay to play fees and NDAs and such, which they will have to do as there are crops that require headers they simply don't make. What a bold milestone it is when John Deere has now added what's effectively DRM for their headers and attachments, if true.
"....does not plan to make available or support development of a compatibility bundle for the X9 combine"... That seems pretty definitive. shame..
 

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What I find sad here----is that connector is part of the ISO 11783 standard. This standard was created to allow & encourage interoperability - that one brand tillage tool would be able to connect & talk a different brand of tractor. If you look at the standards sheets, that is one of the stated goals. But if the latest info we have is correct, JD takes that standard (at least the plug design), and uses it to create the exact opposite situation--- a proprietary encrypted interface which makes it nearly impossible to use anything except a matching JD header. No MacDon, Honeybee, Geringhoff, Drago, or even older JD heads allowed. Why, they wouldn't work properly anyway - of course!

It would be nice to think that farmers would refuse to purchase these combines until JD allowed compatibility - this is unlikely as JD's customer base is probably wondering why anybody would want a different brand head anyway....:rolleyes::whistle:
 

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Some are more comfortable than others. Deere's cabs on the 20 and 30 series tractors hit a real sweet spot for comfort and usability at least for me.

And I've never found any other brand to have steering that's as smooth as Deere's steering. Case steering is pretty hard in comparison. Although like my brother says, who actually steers machines anymore!
 

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Don’t you think that because John Deere uses a half dozen or more sensor channels across the width of their cutterbars so the thing doesn’t bite the ground on a convex knob or ridge in the field accounts for some of the compatibility issues.

Unless I’m missing something, no one else lifts or twists the header automatically when the cutterbar is about to encounter trouble in the central area of the header.

Presumably they would use the same signals to control their new hydraulic hinged header as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Don’t you think that because John Deere uses a half dozen or more sensor channels across the width of their cutterbars so the thing doesn’t bite the ground on a convex knob or ridge in the field accounts for some of the compatibility issues.

Unless I’m missing something, no one else lifts or twists the header automatically when the cutterbar is about to encounter trouble in the central area of the header.

Presumably they would use the same signals to control their new hydraulic hinged header as well.
Yup, I think your right and they probably need a controller for all the valves their new header has too. But agco stuff has the basic signals AND canbus on the legacy connector so that they don't block existing headers, and still allow new stuff. Time will tell I guess if this is a good play for them... ultimately farmers decide the outcome by voting with their wallets.
 

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It's understandable why John Deere uses canbus j1939 to talk to the headers. Other companies could do something similar. I'm surpised it hasn't been done before this point. In fact it would be to everyone's benefit if there were standardized or at least published information on doing it to promote interoperability. I have no problem with John Deere using a digital bus connection with the header. My problem is with them wanting to use it to lock out other manufacturers from making heads for their combines.

By the way, there's a difference between being encrypted and simply undocumented and proprietary. So far as I know, none of the ECUs on any of Deere's machines encrypt the packets on the canbus. They do, however, use mostly proprietary PGNs that are not documented outside of an NDA, and there likely is a degree of handshaking between ECUs to prevent third-party devices from working. However as the automotive industry embraces encrypted canbus because of "security" you can bet all ag companies will also adopt it.

The only farmers' wallets that matter to John Deere really are their loyal renters I mean customers, particularly huge farms that buy whole fleets every other year. For the rest of us, the X9 was never intended for us anyway, and is likely not a good fit. It's certainly not a good fit for my farm.
 

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I think your forgetting a basic thing with the headers regardless of the electrical. All deeres existing headers fit a 55" feederhouse, not the 67" feederhouse on the X9.
 

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I think your forgetting a basic thing with the headers regardless of the electrical. All deeres existing headers fit a 55" feederhouse, not the 67" feederhouse on the X9.
I don't think the main complaint is that the old deer heads won't fit on the new machine, rather its the short line headers from MacDon, Honeybee, Geringhoff, Midwest and the rest won't work because of the proprietary electronics from Deere. I'm sure MacDon and Honeybee would fit with a change to there adapter. I don't know what percentage of buyers who would be looking at an X9 would want to keep their old headers, but around here its not uncommon to swap the adapter plate and put your old header on a new machine. There is several Deere machines with Case branded Macdon headers, There is a guy with 4 claas machines and each macdon head has different colored plastics on the end of the header.
 
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