I know it has been a problem on the 500 series combines and was wondering if Claas has found a solution to the problem. I know HHS has a weld on kit to help take the weight off of the bolts, and seriously thinking of getting it to stop our bolts from breaking. I worry about roading ours and having the wheel fly off. Has Claas ever helped with cost of installing one of these kits? I could see this as a liability issue from there stand piont. What are your guy's recommendations? Thanks.
Lexion Dual bolts breaking
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If I had mine apart again I would put bolts in instead of studs so I can easily replace them with out taking the wheels apart. I would also drill inbetween the existing studs and put 10 more bolts in the circle so you have 20 instead of 10. Your dreaming if you think Claas would pay to do something on this. The 700 series has virtually double the amount of bolts from what I saw on a friends combine.
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What are your tire pressures? I usually have a couple studs break through out the year. I've found it to be tire pressure related. '98 lex 460
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What size tires and pressures are you talking?
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I'm runnin on dual 20.8/42's. Usually have one stud break. So far this year I haven't had one yet.
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Claas are not the only ones having this trouble with duals. My yellow beast has had a few bolts break & last year, then the complete set was changed & tightened to 1000lbs
'And guess what - I'm not "the only one" in the world who is having this trouble.
Don't know if that's a comforting position to be in or a worrying position.
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382 Posts
Had a number of studs break on a couple different new holland duals. You gotta really watch turning on side hills with a full 10 ton of grain on top of you. These combines are a lot bigger than they used to be.
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I had this problem the first two years of running 570s with 620/ 42 duals. Now I haven't broke a stud in going on 3 years.
Here is a list of things that have worked for me so far
32psi inside 28 psi outside
Torque studs to 475ft lbs with the tires off the ground, not 516ft lbs. And only retorque once (I always broke studs after I retorqued or during the retorque)
I put wheel indicators from a truck shop on the nuts (there 33mms but they will stay on) that way you will see if a nut is loosing off from the cart, truck or other combine. Its mainly for piece of mind. I have not had one come loose yet.
I should add we always move with the Macdon headers on and sometimes on narrow dirt roads with grader ridges
Here is a list of things that have worked for me so far
32psi inside 28 psi outside
Torque studs to 475ft lbs with the tires off the ground, not 516ft lbs. And only retorque once (I always broke studs after I retorqued or during the retorque)
I put wheel indicators from a truck shop on the nuts (there 33mms but they will stay on) that way you will see if a nut is loosing off from the cart, truck or other combine. Its mainly for piece of mind. I have not had one come loose yet.
I should add we always move with the Macdon headers on and sometimes on narrow dirt roads with grader ridges
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Do not over torque. The torque spec of 475lb is a dry torque with no oil. If you put oil on the stud you will have to drop the torque by 25% to 356 lb. I try not to retorque because it keeps stretching the stud making it break quicker.
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Case too. Lots of Case rims being replaced as well. We had both outer rims replaced and about half the studs that weren't broken snapped off trying to undo the nuts. Case reckoned they have fixed the problem by putting flat washers under some of the nuts. Yer right! Did hear a rumour from our dealer that the larger Cases will only be available in Aust on tracks as of next year.Claas are not the only ones having this trouble with duals. My yellow beast has had a few bolts break & last year, then the complete set was changed & tightened to 1000lbs
And guess what - I'm not "the only one" in the world who is having this trouble.
Don't know if that's a comforting position to be in or a worrying position.
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2,120 Posts
Yes, "new types nuts" with washers were installed but it was the bolts that are breaking. Causal or symptom? - good question.
All wheel options available on big toys as long as you tick the tracks box! Not this black duck.
Running 42's and I believe 24 psi or 32 psi (memory), but always running 2 psi less in outer dual. I dont have a torque wrench that will go that high. Dealer did one side this Fall, and torqued them. Have not had one of these break (knock on wood). Maybe I should get a torque wrench before I tackle this. Thanks guy's.
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You criminal!
UM, cough.
Moved three machines yesterday headers on.
Beacon equipped pickup truck pilot, radio communication between all.
Oh, two headers were Honeybee, so I guess that's ok.
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We have been "advised" to run the pressure in the duals (620/70R42) at 38-40 PSI. There has been many bead failures at low pressures - we're told.
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Very good points. I have often wondered how much torque do you need on a bolt to hold the two parts from moving? If you over torque, whatever that may be, there is little strength left in the bolt to handle the added weight of 10 tons of grain and the extra weight transferred to the downhill side or outside of a fast turn. My 590 spec is 520ish which I have been running without trouble- 900 single. I wonder what grade the studs/bolts are? Big difference between 520-475-356 or whatever it gets tightened to when no torque wrench is available. I broke down and bought a decent 1" drive 700 ft lb wrench from Napa a few years ago. $520 I think it was. Snap-on was $9800
These specs are a LOT less than you might guess. I watched one of my guys with a 1" flex handle and 4' of pipe jumping on the handle and wondering why the bolts just don't seem to be getting tighter!! 200 lbs on a 5' wrench is 1000 ft lbs is it not? It was on my 480 with duals and I wound up putting longer bolts in and nuts on the inside to get things to tighten up properly. 3 years since that and all ok.
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Transaxial did your 480 have studs originally that you replaced with bolts? What I did not realize is when you oil the thread you better decrease your torque wrench setting by 25%. We always oil threads but am more careful now once I got this info to not over torque.
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It would appear that even the style of nut used on the same size of stud can change the torque specification a lot. An example is the two Mud Hogs we have on our JD 9600's, one was bought quite a few years ago while the other one was purchased in more recent times. The new one came with a standard cone style lug nut to fit into the tapered hole of the wheel and the torque ( I'd have to look at the wheel for the spec ) is much higher. The older unit used the style of nut that is most commonly found on highway trucks and trailers with the two in one piece unit that is supposed to have some oil squirted down into the parts that rotate on one another to reduce friction. That friction difference obviously is making it far easier to turn the nut on this style of nut and would way over torque ( or probably stretch/break ) the stud if one used the higher torque of the other style nut. Just something to be aware of as I hadn't really thought about it that much myself either.
Wishful thinking that I have a large torque wrench as everything I've looked at price wise was thousands ... so I use the math method of what Transaxial mentioned. Weigh myself with all my work gear on, then compute how far out from the center of the socket end of the wrench that my hand has to be to apply lets say that 500 foot pounds and with the wrench parallel to the ground I put my whole weight on the wrench at that measurement on my snipe pipe, no bouncing on the snipe handle though !.
Wishful thinking that I have a large torque wrench as everything I've looked at price wise was thousands ... so I use the math method of what Transaxial mentioned. Weigh myself with all my work gear on, then compute how far out from the center of the socket end of the wrench that my hand has to be to apply lets say that 500 foot pounds and with the wrench parallel to the ground I put my whole weight on the wrench at that measurement on my snipe pipe, no bouncing on the snipe handle though !.
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Northern a good place to buy a big cheap torque wrench is at princes auto. When they have them on sale they are less than $200 and work well. What I have never understood is why claas uses big steel bushings between the nut and the rim making the stud really long.
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