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I am a selector for a company not to be named. Chitting is pregermination, and it is more for long term germing rather than right away. Chances are you have it tested within weeks of harvest, so even if it is highly chitted, the germ will still be fairly strong. Retest that in a month and it will go down, and by seeding time, most of the chit will be dead, storage plays a role in this.


As for price spread, there is a difference in the varieties. Metcalfe is usually the highest price because that is what the foreign buyers want, but it is also the worst of the big 3 agronomically. Synergy and Copeland are basically even right now, little better to get Copeland selected because there is more stable demand.


Bow and Connect are the next two malts in Canada that are making noise, but there is limited demand for these varieties, I would be sure to have them contracted before growing them.
 

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I am a selector for a company not to be named. Chitting is pregermination, and it is more for long term germing rather than right away. Chances are you have it tested within weeks of harvest, so even if it is highly chitted, the germ will still be fairly strong. Retest that in a month and it will go down, and by seeding time, most of the chit will be dead, storage plays a role in this.


As for price spread, there is a difference in the varieties. Metcalfe is usually the highest price because that is what the foreign buyers want, but it is also the worst of the big 3 agronomically. Synergy and Copeland are basically even right now, little better to get Copeland selected because there is more stable demand.


Bow and Connect are the next two malts in Canada that are making noise, but there is limited demand for these varieties, I would be sure to have them contracted before growing them.
What kind of price spreads between the 3 main ones? Haven’t grown malt before, but looking at synergy.
 

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I understand that, but from a seed perspective that would mean my germination would be around 70%. If germination is at 96% what does it matter what % is chitted when sticking it in the ground.
I cleaned some 12% chitted copeland with 96% germ a few years ago. By spring it was in the mid 80% range for germ. Not too bad. I had some left over and the next year it only germed 50%. It seems that the germ is also very unstable on barley that has been exposed to moisture.

Cargill does a test on the malt barley samples that indicated the stability of the germ. I have some malt right now that is 0% chitted and 96% germ, but their stability test is in the danger zone and then think the germ will drop off drastically before spring. Perhaps they could run this test on barley that people might be thinking of keeping for seed?
 

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We got $4.76 for synergy..Feed special at $3.75 today.
Viterra took our synergy with in 2 weeks of acceptance.
Even feed beats $5.00 buck wht..
 

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The problem with the RVA testing is it does not take storage conditions into account. If you had very high RVA numbers and poor storage, it is as bad or worse than moderate RVA numbers with very good storage. It gives you a false comfort to get high numbers and think that the barley will keep for long term, so it is not managed as closely.
 

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When elevators test for malt, will results be consistent ?

Good question do you submit your samples to more than 1 elevator?

How about more than 1 elevator company?

Do local elevators accept or reject or do they all go to head office for selection?

Does maltsters take elevator results or do farmers submit separate samples directly to malt houses?
 

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I grew malt one year everything was perfect, germ, chit, plumpness. It was excepted the company even picked it up got a call a wk later it was rejected due to low germ .. really how could that be. We were screwed, they had our barley and no way to get it back. Basically they paid us feed price and sold it for malt. Bunch of no good crooks, somethings just change.
Whenever I think about growing malt that episode leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.
 

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The problem with the RVA testing is it does not take storage conditions into account. If you had very high RVA numbers and poor storage, it is as bad or worse than moderate RVA numbers with very good storage. It gives you a false comfort to get high numbers and think that the barley will keep for long term, so it is not managed as closely.
So what does a lower RVA number mean to germ for say seed to be used next spring? I think my RVA was in the mid 80's. If stored really cold will the low RVA still germ properly next spring for malt, or is it at big risk of losing the germ? How does moisture affect the germ? Say the barley is 15% or 16% moisture and cool, will it lose its germ worse than dry 13.5% barley? Just looking for general guidelines. Never heard of a RVA number till this fall.
 

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Chitting is hard to predict in regards to germination. Last year my Metcalfe went malt except the stuff that got snowed on and I got off in mid-October. Submitted sample for malt and was 96% germ and something like 10% chitted and everything else was good and 51 lbs so was neither accepted or rejected, just put on hold. I cleaned and seeded it this year and will do again next year. Sitting in a flat bottom bin with no air. Probed bin this fall and sent sample in and once again on hold - neither accepted or rejected so nothing really changed. Sent samples to elevator and RayGlen with same answer.

The malt game is kind of crappy. They pissed a lot of guys off with the crap pulled a few years ago. Accepted as malt, wasn't called in for delivery, would have to buy out contract to sell it and then told it was feed when finally called for months later.

However here feed is $3.16 at elevator and malt is $5.12. I can get at best $3.80 bu for feed FOB farm right now through Rayglen or Johnson grain. Usually get malt but $3.20 won't pay bills. Brokers fob farm here were around $3.20 bu mid September if I remember right. Being near feedlot alley changes things as its closer to $4.50 now through broker I would estimate.
 

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All our specs done at Viterra plant.. Specs were Very Good..They submitted it for germ before we delivered it..
Came back 94%...
 

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Good question do you submit your samples to more than 1 elevator?

How about more than 1 elevator company?

Do local elevators accept or reject or do they all go to head office for selection?

Does maltsters take elevator results or do farmers submit separate samples directly to malt houses?
I grew synergy and metcalfe this year. Submitted multiple samples of each to Viterra and Pioneer .
Viterra grades harder on chitting, 3-5% higher.
Pioneer would only accept metcalfe under 3% chit, viterra 10%.
Pioneer said my synergy failed germ test, 92%. Viterra said it was great 98%
All of my samples were taken out of same pail , at the same time,for each elevator .
I guess they do different tests.
Doesn't give a guy a lot of confidence to make a contract knowing the sample failed at the other elevator.
Both elevators send samples to head office for selection.
 

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This is our first year for synergy. Both viterra and pioneer say metcalfe is on the way out and synergy is what they want us to grow. But when it comes time to buy it they will take metcalfe in a flash, even with problems, and will drag their ass on buying synergy, even for a discounted price.
 

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I gave up and on the malt game years ago! Got tired of the BS from maltsters! The last year I grew malt, I had production contract for $6.75 which was great, because the price come fall was $5.25, everything was good with my samples, except they kept coming back at 93% germ and minimum germ they wanted was 95%! Very convenient way for them to get out of the contract. Im sure that if I would have signed a contract for $5.25 and the fall price was $6.75 they would have taken it! I now only grow feed barley and can usually grow 10% more than malt, it can be up to 15.5 with usually no discounts, I can move it when I want to move it, not wait until July or August, only to have it rejected then! Feed barley is worry and hassle free for me!
 

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So what does a lower RVA number mean to germ for say seed to be used next spring? I think my RVA was in the mid 80's. If stored really cold will the low RVA still germ properly next spring for malt, or is it at big risk of losing the germ? How does moisture affect the germ? Say the barley is 15% or 16% moisture and cool, will it lose its germ worse than dry 13.5% barley? Just looking for general guidelines. Never heard of a RVA number till this fall.


Low RVA is generally low shelf life. 80 is right at the border for stable, but I have found storage conditions play more a roll than RVA numbers. Lower RVA stored at dry, cool, clean will drag on surprisingly long, whereas higher RVA held tough and warm will die off sooner. Also, high moisture this year really seems to be hurting the germs, stuff that is 0 chit that germed well right off the combine is losing germ quite quickly. The reason that few companies do RVA is there is no real science behind it, it is an indicator of shelf life assuming everything else is perfect. I have seen many guys get caught thinking the 150 RVA was indestructible so they sat on it under less than ideal conditions and it dies, where the lower RVA stuff that they maintained well held its germ much longer.
 

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Growing and selecting malt this year has been a real head ache. Moisture issues, high chit numbers, low protein, just to name a few. Also, germs failing for no apparent reason where stuff that should be failing is getting good germs.
Also, the selection of malt is highly dependent on where the barley is going to end up, there are 3 groups of customers. Domestic maltsters are very picky on the barley they chose, it really is the best of the best. Then there are the premium export customers, they have higher contract prices, but also set very high standards. Finally there are the "easier" export markets, lower final price, but they also have lower quality demands. Without knowing where the barley is ending up, it is hard to compare one elevator company to the other, as they are adjusting their selections based off the end users specs.
As for different germ numbers between places, remember that these are done on 100 seeds, so getting a different result is not a surprise because it only takes a couple of the failing seeds to make a big percent difference. Personally if I was growing malt, I would request a regerm on anything that fails with a 92+ germ. Like I said, you just need to get 3 right seeds in there to get there germ to pass.
 

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Good question do you submit your samples to more than 1 elevator?

How about more than 1 elevator company?

Do local elevators accept or reject or do they all go to head office for selection?

Does maltsters take elevator results or do farmers submit separate samples directly to malt houses?

As far As I know, all the companies submit to head office for selection as it is not just a look at it and pass or fail, there are things like vomi, 3 day germ tests, varietal purity, that are a little more than what can be done at the locations.


Maltsters are all different on how they take submissions. Most will have producer direct programs if you are within their catchment area, and then you can submit directly to the malt house. For malt coming from the companies, they contract with the companies to deliver X amount in a given time, and it is up to the company to find the grain that meets their specs. Onced the grain is in the elevator the maltsters may require the locations to for ward a sample of what is going to be shipped for further approval from the malt houses. Other malthouses use just the companies selections and trust that what is being sent will meet specs.
 
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