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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just curious to know if the engineering behind the concept has proven sound or not. Not trying to start some war or something. But I and I know many others, would really like to know if the claims of less weight are true or not?

Previous thread.

Are there any side by side field comparisons with legitimate comparable equipment available? Not a new Morris against a worn and dull JD or something, but legit comparisons that can show real world weight advantages?

If so, this might open up new markets in places that can not run the heavy weights of the competition. But the engineers that hold masters in mechanical engineering that I have exposed this to, seem to not agree with the claims made.

So it's been a few years now since the drill concept was put out. Is there any proof of concept available to us? Or are they trying to pull the wool over as they say?
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Prior to buying our seed master the Morris disc drill is what our hearts were set on, the rep wouldn't even give me a brochure as he said it was junk, last year I heard one made it to the area, hired to seed some winter wheat, I didn't get to actually see the machine, I seen where it had seeded later in the year, looked like crap but recently found out the crp it was seeded on had the moldboard in her followed by a wishic disc, so a stand at all made a statement that it probably ain't to bad being so far out of its own nature
 

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I don't think you're going to hear the definitive answer you're looking for. I'll give you my take on what effects are taking place in this apparatus and I think you can decipher an answer for yourself. Or weld something together and possibly get a different result.

This concept is nothing new at all, the theory is roll centre, its involved in virtually all truck and automotive suspensions no matter how simplistic.

I personally believe that most of the application of the theory in modern times makes it very hard to understand because they teach that the lines of force aim for the centre axis of the wheel. This is all fine and well until you transfer the same science onto a snowmobile, where the line of force is the contact point on the ice. It really doesn't matter, what's important is knowing which direction to move the location points to increase or decrease the powerful roll centre effect. Of course in a suspension the forces are transverse but in this case things are just turned 90 degrees, so now the force pathway is actually at the centre bearing on the forward leading disc. In the dynamic reality of this situation the real line of force likely oscillates somewhere near the midpoint between the bearing and the loaded cutting edge on the forward bottom of the disc.

The packer wheel on the rear of the walking beam confuses the understanding in this case. Imagine if it was removed and a 10 foot long handle was welded to the back of the walking beam. Now you can walk behind the drill as it is moving and slowly lift the handle. At a certain height of the handle the forces will go directly from the cut soil through the forward half of the walking beam to its central pivot, there will be little to no pressure on the handle you are holding. The roll centre will be in a neutral equilibrium with the line of force.

Or you could weld the walking beam pivot in that spot and get back in the cab.

I think the design is fine the forces they are talking about relate to how the roll centre transfers weight off of the rear packer and into the cutting disc, some other designs do the same thing but in a different way, as soon as the disc shallows out from excess residue the packer closer wheel is floating. Some older designs are different.

Anything near this equilibrium point in an actual suspension will handle horrific and have a knife edge feel with no sense of impending limit of the centre of gravity and will snap roll you if you have unlimited traction.
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I don't think you're going to hear the definitive answer you're looking for. I'll give you my take on what effects are taking place in this apparatus and I think you can decipher an answer for yourself. Or weld something together and possibly get a different result.

This concept is nothing new at all, the theory is roll centre, its involved in virtually all truck and automotive suspensions no matter how simplistic.

I personally believe that most of the application of the theory in modern times makes it very hard to understand because they teach that the lines of force aim for the centre axis of the wheel. This is all fine and well until you transfer the same science onto a snowmobile, where the line of force is the contact point on the ice. It really doesn't matter, what's important is knowing which direction to move the location points to increase or decrease the powerful roll centre effect. Of course in a suspension the forces are transverse but in this case things are just turned 90 degrees, so now the force pathway is actually at the centre bearing on the forward leading disc. In the dynamic reality of this situation the real line of force likely oscillates somewhere near the midpoint between the bearing and the loaded cutting edge on the forward bottom of the disc.

The packer wheel on the rear of the walking beam confuses the understanding in this case. Imagine if it was removed and a 10 foot long handle was welded to the back of the walking beam. Now you can walk behind the drill as it is moving and slowly lift the handle. At a certain height of the handle the forces will go directly from the cut soil through the forward half of the walking beam to its central pivot, there will be little to no pressure on the handle you are holding. The roll centre will be in a neutral equilibrium with the line of force.

Or you could weld the walking beam pivot in that spot and get back in the cab.

I think the design is fine the forces they are talking about relate to how the roll centre transfers weight off of the rear packer and into the cutting disc, some other designs do the same thing but in a different way, as soon as the disc shallows out from excess residue the packer closer wheel is floating. Some older designs are different.

Anything near this equilibrium point in an actual suspension will handle horrific and have a knife edge feel with no sense of impending limit of the centre of gravity and will snap roll you if you have unlimited traction.
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I'd say you are probably right about not getting a direct answer.

I do understand the concept, it's the application claims that made me ask some engineer types and they all seem to feel it is marketing hype and not really possible to accomplish as claimed.

Do they not make it anymore?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
There are a few constants that can not be changed no matter the structure design above the disk. One is that x diameter and thickness of blade at x angle will meet the same resistance to enter the soil, no matter the brand or down pressure application type.

The only way the Morris can apply more soil penetrating pressure, is if it is running less openers than the machine it is comparing to.

Yes, the closing wheel spring on the other brands does go against the opener's down pressure, but it has control over closing pressure. The Morris design looses this control. So any added penetrating pressure gained from the walking beam, is not free. It comes at the price of closing wheel control.

I was just curious of anyone had run these next to the competition and if it performed as the ad said in relation to using less weight to get better soil penetration. That's the only real concern I have. If they can, great. Then I would have to look seriously at them for a mid row banding apparatus for my area and cropping.
 

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Any chance you can get a demo in your area to see first hand? Surely they must have had some competitive info around somewhere.
I've only heard from friends up in North NSW where they have sold several that they are going well, but no detailed info.
 
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