The Combine Forum banner
1 - 20 of 34 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
78 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Has anybody chipped an S670 and not have any issues? I'm cutting wheat that's laying down w a 630F and it's killing this machine all day long. Low rpm alarm constantly going off. I've got it opened up as far as possible without losing to much grain but the power is just not there. Also replaced fuel filters and air filter. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
683 Posts
I have heard rumors that the 670 lacks power compared to the 9770. All of the colonies around here are replacing their 9770s with S680s for this reason I've been told.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
707 Posts
When we chipped our 9770's we had issues with air intake temp alarm going off at times, certainly gave you more power though maybe getting your ECU remapped would be the way to go here in Aus we had Agritune Australia do our Lexion with great results
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
324 Posts
Contact you dealer and ask them to look to see if there are any new software updates for your machine. I just did a new ECU software update on a 4940 that wouldn't pull itself up a hill with out the engine almost stalling. After the download it was like a new machine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,052 Posts
Ok, I don't get it, You buy a S670 and there are 2 models bigger to choose from and then you complain about lack of power...maybe you should have gotten the S680 or S690. Just sayin.:rolleyes:;):cool:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
514 Posts
Ok, I don't get it, You buy a S670 and there are 2 models bigger to choose from and then you complain about lack of power...maybe you should have gotten the S680 or S690. Just sayin.:rolleyes:;):cool:
I don't blame him. For lots of guys around here the 9770 made sense. Didn't want the bigger combine because in anything but wheat you usually aren't limited by power. But when they traded of their 9770's they found that they were losing ground speed in a S670 that was supposed to be a direct replacement.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
209 Posts
We have tuned quite a few tier 4a John Deere S series combines with very good results now. If you are considering a performance tuning upgrade I think you would be very happy with Ekotuning. All the S series combines I personally tuned last summer / fall were due to customers trading to new combine of same class size but not being very impressed with performance. Even long distance customers can easily realize the benifits of upgraded Ekotuning software using the hand held programmer.

That being said I would agree with the comment of making sure all factory updates are done and there are no known issues with machine before making any type of upgrade.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Contact you dealer and ask them to look to see if there are any new software updates for your machine. I just did a new ECU software update on a 4940 that wouldn't pull itself up a hill with out the engine almost stalling. After the download it was like a new machine.
It is good you have posted this. If the combines need more HP and they
have an update for the sprayer, then Deere should just offer an update
for the combines, as we have heard the new 2014 models have the change.

It is too bad some do complain about HP, when it is available, in the
very same machine, next model year. I hope Deere does not want
these owners to trade to a different make, such as Cat or Case.

Deere, are you watching, you can offer the higher tune, no reason to
go with Eko, or Stein, and have to spend $3K.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
209 Posts
Dpf life / regen cycles are not negatively affected, actually some customers claim less frequent regen cycles. I have never had any error code issues on John Deere machines, including tier 4a machines. A great deal of r&d testing goes into Ekotuning software upgrades for each engine series. All tuning is based off original oem software from each machine so all factory updates and options programmed into a given machine are kept intact.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,994 Posts
I'm just a little critical here, so don't take this as a personal attack, but.....seems like if the DPF is unaffected and you create more power, then why didn't Deere do this from the beginning? If you have tuned the motor then it's pretty likely the DPF must collect more soot from your tuning. If it doesn't it means you are increasing combustions temps, which means potential cooling issues and decreased life of EGR cooler, turbo, etc...and error codes, or stored "out of parameter" data for Deere to void my warranty.

Either way what you do is illegal. And voids any warranty. And don't take this the wrong way, but it's hard to trust the claims of an illegal tune....... Besides, Deere is collecting your data from JDLink, and that's not a road I'd want to go down on a new combine...... I'm sure the power is increased...any claim after that is much harder for me to swallow....
Look at how often the same engine is used at multiple power levels where only the programming is changed. How is it illegal? Also they can only deny a warranty claim if they can prove that the failure was the result of the alterations. But that shouldn't be an issue, because everyone knows john Deeres never break down.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,919 Posts
I get what FJ is saying about the warranty issue. Any company of any color would reject a warranty claim if they can find the smallest thing. I do not get the illegal part. What is illegal about it?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,232 Posts
Illegal, yes it is, if you get caught, under warranty I wouldn't recommend it, if something abnormal happens to engine, mfg will be all over it, Ecotuning and Steinbauer don't leave a foot print on ecm, I know this is a debated issue, want hp buy it, either choice works well, Scott.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,232 Posts
The tuned engine does not pass EPA emissions....therefore it is illegal. You are altering emissions components. You just wait till the EPA shows up at John Deere's doorstep and says, "hey, we'd like to see your JDLink data that shows engines that are not meeting EPA regs." A S670 motor is the highest output version of this motor...if there was more power in it Deere would be using it... This tune has to be running increased boost, increased EGR temps, increased fuel delivery, increased exhaust temps....pick any one of those and it is either reducing fuel consumption, engine life, or DPF life. It's not a personal attack on this poster, but I just find these whole tune things to be pretty ridiculous. As if this company has better resources than the maker of the engine to "tune" it better. A dealer is also obligated to mark a machine "tuned" through the Deere dealer license agreement, so if you bring it in for service and they see it's tuned, they are now in a pretty awkward position. It doesn't take a genius to log into the machine with ServcieAdvisor and see a slew of engine parameters are far outside of factory specs. Since these machines have a 5 year emissions warranty, you are playing with fire in my opinion altering emissions components.
Agree with JD link, you are really playing with fire, if its out of warranty its on your nickel, look how EPA has cracked down on deletes for auto industry, I realize most of us live out in the boonies, just a matter of time before EPA get ugly with ag industry, Scott.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,919 Posts
Wasn't even thinking the EPA route, that makes perfect sense. You're right just a matter of time before they really crack down on ag, and I fear the clock is ticking a lot faster than any of us realize.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
209 Posts
I definitely dont take offense of any type or take this personal. I will try to address some of the questions / concerns posted above;

Why doesnt JD do this from the beginning? They do, but it costs a lot more. When doing a part by part breakdown it is quite obvious that there is next to no difference in hard parts when comparing engines from a S660 to S670 for example. On the tractor side the same can be said often times as a manufacture will design and build an engine for a certain power level and then detune it with different software to work in multiple applications. That is not to say that if a certain engine has oem hp ratings of 200hp and 350hp for example that there will be zero differences at all but often time major hard parts such as pistons, turbo etc are the same. The JD 8020 series tractors are a perfect example as all major engine components from an 8120 are identical in part numbers to an 8520. Similar can be said for the 9.0L and big 13.5L JD engines used in tier 3 and tier 4a applications. 9.0 engines have an injector change part way through the series. For the most part a 13.5 engine is very much identical. In tier 3 form packaged in a 9330 tractor at 375hp or a 7750 harvester at 625hp and if you look up an engine rebuild kit part number they are the same for both applications. That does not guarantee that the entire machines are identical though. Often times applications like a harvester or combine will have some upgraded drive components etc to handle more power or perhaps larger tractor models in a given series will have a heavier front axle or final drives so that needs to be taken into account when making a performance tuning consideration. There are limitations to every tuning situation and I will always make a customer aware if I think they are making an unreasonable request. The majority of customers that I personally deal with are simply after a modest increase comparable to a larger model in the series. Sometimes customers are more interested in fuel economy and trying to reduce engine load.

As for warranty, any aftermarket product could potentially cause warranty concerns. For the most part dealers are not too concerned about being warranty police but every dealers take on performance upgrades are different. Some dealers are receptive to the idea of customers doing so, others not so much. Generally I would think it will be the manufacture that would cause more issue and possibly deny a warranty claim down the road. Most dealers in our area are very familiar with what we do and are generally pretty receptive to the idea. I attribute most of this to much more advanced technology than what was available for aftermarket tuning even 10 years ago. Essentially we are using the same technology and methods as oem tuning. If we can read and understand engine controller software from a S660 and S670 or a 8130 tractor and a 8430, what are we doing wrong or illegal by reprogramming the lower hp model to equivelant specs of the larger hp model?

As far as emissions, it is very possible to improve efficiency and power without increasing or having a negative effect on emission output. Oem manufactures have to program machinery with a very general calibration that will perform acceptable under all conditions, climates, locations, etc. It is simply not possible for them to be able to fine tune each machine being produced for its intended location, climate and what type of work its going to be doing. Sometimes equipment is produced without even knowing where its final destination will be. We tailor tune each machine using the oem software as a template to each customer's specific requirements and requests.

As a general rule most areas have emissions guidelines for a given hp range or engine type / family. As long as we do not exceed emission out put for that series of engine and its location we are doing nothing illegal as far as emissions.

This type of tuning technology is reasonably new to the ag market in north america but has been used in the diesel pickup truck market for a while now. Ask any skilled Efi Live tuner that works on duramax or cummins trucks and they will agree that it is very possible to improve driveability and performance without having a negative impact on emissions. The new generation LML duramax trucks are a perfect example. We are making excellent power without increasing soot accumulation and sometimes actually lowering it as well as seeing exhaust gas tempuratures lower than stock under certain conditions. As with any type of custom tuning it is only as good as the software engineer making the changes to the engine controller mapping so no matter what type of machinery, vehicle or equipment you would be tuning I would strongly suggest to do your homework and work with a tuning company that has positive feedback and results. There are a lot of hobby tuners out there for trucks and ag equipment but the skilled professional tuners that devote the necessary time to r&d dyno testing, tuning and real world road and field testing and fine tuning are less common and are not found at every speed / performance or repair shop.

At the end of the day, especially when working with a machine that is still under warranty coverage you simply have to weigh the pros and cons of performance upgrades, how much and what methods you intend to use and if you are comfortable with it. Some guys dont have a problem with plugging a chip into a brand new piece of equipment so why is it detrimental to reprogram it to specs of a different model using identical tuning methods as the oem?I would never suggest or try to talk a customer into tuning something they really dont need to or are not comfortable with doing. If there are other questions or something I have missed answering I would be more than happy to try to answer as best I can.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
252 Posts
We can reprogram your combine with a Ekotune built to your spec. You'll be very happy.
If we have a dealer in your area we can tune onsite. Otherwise, we'll ship you a programmer . We are NOT a chip but rather software tuners. The best chip for your engine is the one it came with from the factory. In other words your ECU contains a reprogrammable chip which is what we specialise in.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,232 Posts
I am not arguing that Ecotuning or Steinbauer don't work, emission wise, as long as they meet or exceed epa emissions, fine and dandy if its under warranty and you modify it, well I sure hope you have a understanding dealer, each to there own, I agree alot of components are the same, Scott.
 
1 - 20 of 34 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top