[jazz]

The dilemma of a small farmer - how to best spend capital.

I run 1250 acres just a few miles of Regina. It was all the land I could grab before the BTOs crowded me out. So with that land base I have had to make a few compromises. I currently run a small 34' Bourgault 5710 drill on a 8570 JD 4WD. Works well for the investment. I use my older 8430 4WD to pull a Case SRX 160 sprayer because the SPs are were out of my budget at the time. The PT sprayer is very simple, low maintenance and has a nice 1600 gallon tank, but it has limitations as well. Not as nimble in the field, bit tough to spray in higher crop.

Now after a few years I can afford to inject some cash into equipment but I am uncertain as to the best bang for the buck. The choice is to keep the seeding outfit I have and buy a sprayer, or send the 8570 to pull the sprayer and upgrade the seeder tractor and drill.

Any suggestions?

 

[coogan]

I bought a 2001 case 4260 high clearance sprayer for $95,000 and had floats and new skinny tires, the guy gave me $45000 for my old patriot sprayer so it was $50,000 to upgrade. Sure it has high hours but like you I'm doing 1300 acres and it's more sprayer than I need but it sure is nice to have. I maybe put 50 hrs a year on it so it will last a long time. The real advantage to the high clearance with skinny tires is doing pre harvest dessicating. If you can afford it you will like it a lot more than your pull type sprayer. Changing tires is heavy hard work but I bought an attachment that fits on my tractor bucket and a special jack from Vale solutions.

 

[gumbomb]

Not to go off topic, but what combine do you run?

 

[luuk]

With the amount of acres you have it's hard to justify owning a self propelled sprayer. As one of your neighbours that has one if they want to custom spray for you.

 

[gumbomb]

I would over kill your your harvesting equipment. One bad rain on a wheat crop or windy day for canola swaths can ad up quick. School teachers make good second combine operators in late August. I think harvest capacity is more important then finishing one day sooner when seeding.

 

[SWFarmService]

Sprayer!

The most important piece of equipment on a well oiled farm. IMO

The best way to farm is smarter, not harder, having a good sprayer can help ya make applications more timely. You can make fungicide apps without all the wheel tracks and even do split nitrogen applications

We run a homemade self propelled sprayer and a miller nitro, since we got the nitro with the 120' booms I seem to spend the entire summer in it, by doing the split nitrogen passes and the fungicide at flag leaf and flower we have increased our yields by almost 50%

My advice is get the sprayer and the rest will come if you use it.

 

[jazz]

I run a 9600 with pretty low hours. I stretched to get it and its been pretty reliable but after I make this decision about tractor or sprayer, all extra funds I have will go toward a combine upgrade.

 

[Grainline]

Go for sp sprayer. I bought a 3185 case last year and I wouldn't be with out now.

 

[Bar D]

I agree with everyone else a sprayer is the most used piece of equipment but in my opinion an air drill can make you or break you. You get one shot to grow the best crop you can and if it's not done right at seeding it isn't going to happen. So if your not happy with your current air drill I would be upgrading your tractor and drill.

 

[uthinkyourwet?]

If you are lucky enough to have someone who will custom spray for you, consider that if you are a one man show. My guy comes when I ask him to with any kind of heads up. Saves me so much time, and he has a rig that does it all, so it is pretty much a perfect job. I farm alone, and so when he is spraying, I am seeding ad he can get me ready to seed very fast. If that ain't an option, forget it. For me, it has made my farm very much more efficient, and my concentrated efforts will be on my seeder and combine power. The tractor hardly matters so long as it pulls the drill, which does matter. I think the seeder and combine are most important. A sprayer is too, to be sure, but custom spraying is not that hard to find, and depending on labor issues, can be a real bargain.

 

[rook]

My two bits. If you're happy with your stand establishment than go for the sprayer. A Bourgault drill will last a long time. An old spra coupe will fit your needs. A bit small for fungicide at 10 gpa but if your land is close it's doable.

If your crops have room to improve than upgrade the drill, ignore the tractor. A bushel or two over your acres over a few years starts to add up.

Or if you're like me and it doesn't rain the wallet is shut for a long time.

 

[Hobbyfarmer75]

For those amount of acres i wouldn't buy my own SP. would buy a good tractor to pull the SRX. I had the same and whatever you do Spraying does not get cheaper!!!
I spayed all from Liquid to preharvest. Just my 2 ct.

 

[snapper21]

Still can buy lots of good used pull types for peanuts. Personally wouldn't want the headache of paying for and maintaining an sp sprayer. I farm about the same acres but in hills sloughs rocks. We get it done with a high clearance flexi 67xl and 2590 case. Not to mention a Trimble light bar for guidance. That whole rig cost less than $25 grand. The case gets used to pull the bale stacker as well. The sp is great but I have lots of neighbours with them and not a lot more acres and some of the repair bills for what bit they are used is ridiculous.

 

[farmshop]

The tracks I made today trying to get through the last 200 acres of corn before it got too tall makes me wish for a self propelled so I would have been done sooner. Custom hire is fine as long as you can get it when you need it. Contracted for top dress n on corn so far they got 100 of our 1100 done and they have 4000 more besides

 

[Licensed to kill]

Personally, I don't think anyone can give you a solid answer to your question because there are variables that have not been provided. Some of these have been touched on but, do you have access to a reliable custom operator?, how many high crop passes does your operation require? do you have the man power/time to do all of the spraying without compromising any other part of the operation?. I am a custom operator and I have 3 customers with over 5000 acres each (plus other smaller customers) that do not own a sprayer and I do all of their spraying. For them, they have penciled it out and better value in hiring than owning. There are other farmers around here that farm <3000 acres (some <2000) that own their own $200,000+ sp sprayer because they say it pays to own their own. Some used to hire but bought their own some (one of my 5000+ customers as example) had their own and sold it in favour of hiring. Lots of variables and things to consider.

 

[jazz]

We have a custom operator close by but he is usually a few day wait to get him and he charges $5/acre which adds up to $10,000 a year in custom work for burn off and in crop. That can pay for some equipment pretty fast.

The pull type is totally fine for burn off and its pretty good for incrop too, but when the crop is higher for fungicide or desiccating, it drags on the hitch and we have to jury rig some plywood under there to slipe over the canopy. The pull type is virtually maintenance free. All we do to it is flush the nozzles each spring and its good to go. Also, I can do an entire field at 10 gal/acre without stopping to refill.

The 8570 would fall back to pull the sprayer, harrows/roller and a future grain cart. The newer tractor would probably just be 300 HP and the drill could go to 40-45 ft. Not sure I would buy anything but another 5710. Again these drills are very low maintenance and do a pretty good job in a lot of conditions. Can't justify a paralink yet or maybe ever.

 

[Licensed to kill]

We have a custom operator close by but he is usually a few day wait to get him and he charges $5/acre which adds up to $10,000 a year in custom work for burn off and in crop. That can pay for some equipment pretty fast.

The pull type is totally fine for burn off and its pretty good for incrop too, but when the crop is higher for fungicide or desiccating, it drags on the hitch and we have to jury rig some plywood under there to slipe over the canopy. The pull type is virtually maintenance free. All we do to it is flush the nozzles each spring and its good to go. Also, I can do an entire field at 10 gal/acre without stopping to refill.

The 8570 would fall back to pull the sprayer, harrows/roller and a future grain cart. The newer tractor would probably just be 300 HP and the drill could go to 40-45 ft. Not sure I would buy anything but another 5710. Again these drills are very low maintenance and do a pretty good job in a lot of conditions. Can't justify a paralink yet or maybe ever.

Really?, did you find a sprayer that runs on air, never breaks down, requires no maintenance, doesn't require an operator and supplies it's own water?

 

[meritmat]

and the 10k is a write off.

 

[brazil07]

I think the points above regarding operating costs for sprayers are very important and would like to hear from the custom folk what they feel these are. I pay bit over $6/a to a guy who I think is more dependable, does a better job than I would - backs into corners, headlands, uses high volume water, more than often is doing it on wkends, and keeps an outfit that anybody would want to see in your yard - regardless of color preferences. This guy is better than the best hired man and you do not have to babysit him. My idea of operating costs for a sprayer means that I am likely paying $2.25ish/acre for the luxury of him doing it vs me doing it myself and I will be happy to keep paying that - people pay "consultants" more than that to tell them what to spray, fertilize , or grow(feel much more comfortable making these decisions and cutting those costs out). Maybe though my numbers are biased a bit as have to say that hate spraying as well. I actually feel bad that I do not have more work for him and likely need to consider some split rate fertilizer stuff.

 

[2388h]

Limited budget, upgrade you tractor if the sprayer is in good order. The tractor can pull the sprayer, drill or whatever else you want it to, the SP sprayer can only spray. This gives you more options.